Planning out the 2025 outdoor grow

[Stoneyluv]

wow Tom that sounds serious man, hope she feels better soon!!!

 

[TomH]

Geeze, where to start.
Queue the music to the good, the bad and the ugly.

The last month or so has been awful.
GF, still dealing with mystery illness, another several visits to the er and doctors but no closer to Id or cure.

My chemical nightmare in the weed garden is finally behind me but lots of lost time.

Anyway, here’s the good. Just fun gardening pictures.

 

[TomH]

Here’s the bad,
During all this craziness with my GF and the plants, my daughter got t-boned at a major intersection after lights went out.
Car is totaled, she’s sore but otherwise undamaged, the car did its job. She was lucky, her guardian angel was there for her. She said her momma helped her ( her mom, my wife, passed away five years ago this month), but Jessy swears momma helped her.

Pictures of the plants in the midst of my chemical nightmare.

The smaller the plant, the more the damage, but everything had a lot of damage.

These are about three to four weeks ago.

It was stressful enough, all plants looked like they were going to flower even though our days are 14.5 hours and getting longer.

They have settled down but the two super blue dream plants now have copious points of stigmas everywhere. They will be thick come flower season based on how many budsites they have.

The two smaller ones, KC Wolfenstein and Raspberry Moonshine are hitting their stride, KC got a little lanky but that might be the sativa genes.

 

[TomH]

This isn’t the ugly but I’m too stoned to continue that story so here’s where they are now.

 

[steamroller]

Miss seeing you around more often. Yor garden looks great.
I am glad your daughter is well and hope your girlfriend finds a solution to what ails her.
I am starting to think that with all our fancy smancy indoor growing skills we are making seeds that will never again thrive with outdoor lighting schedules. The longest day here in NY [where I grew outdoors like a machine back in the 80's from bag seed] is only 15 hours and 18 minutes.
I'll be getting my outdoor plants out soon so they can fade like daylight the rest of the year.

 

[Zen_seeker]

Hey Tom, sorry for your bad luck. Lots of that going around these days. Best wishes for your family. My wife went through hell, sort of is still, but they found a med that seems to be working now. Not a fan of the side effects but it is what it is.

Love the plants man. So many varieties and colours. Wife has cactus envy. I don’t buy them for her anymore as they are to expensive to keep torturing with a slow death.

All the best bud.

 

[TomH]

Hey Tom, sorry for your bad luck. Lots of that going around these days. Best wishes for your family. My wife went through hell, sort of is still, but they found a med that seems to be working now. Not a fan of the side effects but it is what it is.

Love the plants man. So many varieties and colours. Wife has cactus envy. I don’t buy them for her anymore as they are to expensive to keep torturing with a slow death.

All the best bud.

Here’s a cactus that bloomed overnight.

 

[Zen_seeker]

Here’s a cactus that bloomed overnight.

Cool, thanks. I’ll show her tonight. Still won’t buy her another though.

 

[BlueCollarBob]

Hate that you guys have been having a rough go of things. It's past time for some good news on diagnosing and treating your girlfriend's health issues. I hope that's in your near future. Huge thanks for taking the time to share your beautiful garden with us. You've surrounded yourself with some amazing plants.

 

[TomH]

Holy smokes, been a busy month or two.

Laura (my GF), is mostly ok but seeing a GI specialist. She has celiac disease which makes anything in the digestive tract worse.
My daughter is driving a newly purchased vehicle compliments of signal outage at a major intersection.
No injuries so thank God for that.

I’m currently doing better than most of this year has been other than joint problems. Keeping active helps but doggone sometimes there’s not enough weed to get rid of the pain.

The plants have recovered from the chemical nightmare. The sativa (KC Wolfenstein) very quietly became bigger than the super blue dream plants. I’m hoping for a good fruiting season.

The indica (blackberry moonshine), is now about a meter tall. The others are about 1.7 meters tall.

A few other things are looking impressive in the yard.

 

[TomH]

The light schedule for the Sativa and the two Super Blue Dream clones is interesting.
the get about 3 hours of bright sky, followed by added 1 hour of reflected sunlight off the nearly white wall. The reflected light is 15k-20k LUX. This is followed by about 5 hours of direct sun with varying amounts of reflected light off the wall. At that point the plants are getting blasted but holding up. The next 5 hours are bight sky with reflected light from the fence and neighbors house.

I’m expecting that the reduced afternoon sunlight will both reduce harvest size and improve taste/aroma because the afternoon sun won’t be boiling the terps off.

On another note, Laura and I went to see Clint Black at the Alameda Co. fair on july 3. It was a good show, but age is making him sound just like Willy Nelson. Still a good show, lots of weird Bay Area people.

 

[TomH]

Here in California, at least at the latitude where we are, July 31 is the day nature flips the plant and the stretch begins.

I’ll be trimming back all the plants the week of July 14 to get ready for the stretch and flowering.

I had them trimmed back really hard right after bug spray incident and all of a sudden, they are dense again.

They are beefy!

 

[stonemason]

Looking great tomm.

 

[TomH]

Well, all of a sudden the girls put on some size and weight.

Still a couple weeks away from flowering to begin but they sure all seem to be growing significantly.

We’ve battled grasshoppers pretty hard this year. I’m spraying weekly with cannacontrol. It’s essential oil based like most others. It’s effective but I’m concerned as we move into flowering. Last year we were hammered by caterpillars so I have to spray more but I don’t like smelling oils on weed.

I’ll give them a good h2o2 dunk when harvested.

 

[stonemason]

Well, all of a sudden the girls put on some size and weight.

Still a couple weeks away from flowering to begin but they sure all seem to be growing significantly.

We’ve battled grasshoppers pretty hard this year. I’m spraying weekly with cannacontrol. It’s essential oil based like most others. It’s effective but I’m concerned as we move into flowering. Last year we were hammered by caterpillars so I have to spray more but I don’t like smelling oils on weed.

I’ll give them a good h2o2 dunk when harvested. View attachment 108295View attachment 108296View attachment 108297View attachment 108298View attachment 108299View attachment 108300View attachment 108301

I don't remember the details you will have to do some research,but at the farm I worked at they sprayed for the catapelars or the moth that lays the eggs can't remember which ,during certain times in the moon cycle.It worked we never had catapelars after the first year.

 

[BlueCollarBob]

Well, all of a sudden the girls put on some size and weight.

Still a couple weeks away from flowering to begin but they sure all seem to be growing significantly.

We’ve battled grasshoppers pretty hard this year. I’m spraying weekly with cannacontrol. It’s essential oil based like most others. It’s effective but I’m concerned as we move into flowering. Last year we were hammered by caterpillars so I have to spray more but I don’t like smelling oils on weed.

I’ll give them a good h2o2 dunk when harvested. View attachment 108295View attachment 108296View attachment 108297View attachment 108298View attachment 108299View attachment 108300View attachment 108301

The plants look great… again.

I did the peroxide bath on two plants last year and didn’t like it. I’ll have to figure something else out, if I’m going to wash it. Not sure how to explain it, it just didn’t smoke as good as the unwashed plants. Plus, I didn’t really get much noticeable stuff washed off. The diluted peroxide and the rinse water in the totes didn’t get noticeably dirty.

Does the Cannacontrol work on the moths/caterpillars, too? Or, is that just for the grasshoppers? I’m hoping we’re almost through out caterpillar season (before flowering kicks in). MonterreyBT and Dead Bug have both been effective for those, but I’d be interested in an essential oil alternative.

 

[TomH]

The plants look great… again.

I did the peroxide bath on two plants last year and didn’t like it. I’ll have to figure something else out, if I’m going to wash it. Not sure how to explain it, it just didn’t smoke as good as the unwashed plants. Plus, I didn’t really get much noticeable stuff washed off. The diluted peroxide and the rinse water in the totes didn’t get noticeably dirty.

Does the Cannacontrol work on the moths/caterpillars, too? Or, is that just for the grasshoppers? I’m hoping we’re almost through out caterpillar season (before flowering kicks in). MonterreyBT and Dead Bug have both been effective for those, but I’d be interested in an essential oil alternative.

Canna control is supposed to be for most flies, worms, caterpillars, mites, but its not really for grasshoppers.
nothing I can find will affect those MFs

 

[TomH]

Well, right on schedule, I can see a stretch taking place on all plants.

No bud set but a ton of stigma pairs popping out of every nook and cranny.

This is indica/hybrid, blackberry moonshine. A bit over four feet tall, three ish feet wide.

Bugs are rough this year. Going to start two a week spraying until I see buds, then I’ll go more of a targeted spraying routine.

I want bugs to tell their friends, this place sucks! Great view but that spray tasted like crap!

 

[TomH]

The sativa (KC Wolfenstein) and the sativa/hybrids (super blue dream) both were overgrown when I arrived here this morning. I should have taken pictures as all three plants just joined together into a hedge.

I reduced their horizontal spread enough that I can wriggle between them now, I’m going to need to do a scrog sort of thing to keep them under the fence line.

I spent about twenty minutes softening and bending upper stems, as soon as I was done, they were back upright.

They are a little wobbly looking but not laying flat, going to have to tie them down.

 

[freezeland]

The sativa (KC Wolfenstein) and the sativa/hybrids (super blue dream) both were overgrown when I arrived here this morning. I should have taken pictures as all three plants just joined together into a hedge.

I reduced their horizontal spread enough that I can wriggle between them now, I’m going to need to do a scrog sort of thing to keep them under the fence line.

I spent about twenty minutes softening and bending upper stems, as soon as I was done, they were back upright.

They are a little wobbly looking but not laying flat, going to have to tie them down.

View attachment 109264View attachment 109265View attachment 109266View attachment 109267View attachment 109271View attachment 109279View attachment 109283View attachment 109285View attachment 109288View attachment 109290View attachment 109293View attachment 109295View attachment 109296

I planted 5 Blackberry Moonshine outdoors. Two so far have shown male. One is already in the burn pit and I’ll cull the other out tomorrow. Two of the remaining 3 are showing spades but no pistils yet. The third one is a one off freaky growth thing. Not a reveg’d transplant to outside. These plants were all sowed by seed on April 28th and have been outdoors the entire time. Here is the funky blackberry moonshine.

 

[TomH]

With a plants having shown signs of stretch and now seeing groups of stigma pairs, I’m gonna go out on a limb and say we’re in flower here!
If that’s accepted, end of week 1 of flower (different than stretch in my mind) will be today, 7/28.
End of week 10 will be 9/29 however, I’ll be out of town for a couple weeks.

Looks like harvest will be 10/10, middle of week 12. That indica should be good and stony at that point.

 

[freezeland]

With a plants having shown signs of stretch and now seeing groups of stigma pairs, I’m gonna go out on a limb and say we’re in flower here!
If that’s accepted, end of week 1 of flower (different than stretch in my mind) will be today, 7/28.
End of week 10 will be 9/29 however, I’ll be out of town for a couple weeks.

Looks like harvest will be 10/10, middle of week 12. That indica should be good and stony at that point.

Stigma pairs are always present. It’s the presence of preflowers at their bases is what to watch for.

 

[TomH]

Stigma pairs are always present. It’s the presence of preflowers at their bases is what to watch for.

Yeah, the super blue dream have had them all year, now they are coming in groups of pairs. I think that’s the beginning of setting buds. I expect more, so she will be getting some foliar feeds during stretch and the first weeks of flower. I’ll probably give it two more foliar feeds.

 

[Zen_seeker]

Canna control is supposed to be for most flies, worms, caterpillars, mites, but its not really for grasshoppers.
nothing I can find will affect those MFs

Does soaps like Safer’s help?
I know it kills the eggs from one of my sunflower bugs. Smothers them so they don’t hatch.

Caterpillars and inch worms are our current battle.

 

[TomH]

Does soaps like Safer’s help?
I know it kills the eggs from one of my sunflower bugs. Smothers them so they don’t hatch.

Caterpillars and inch worms are our current battle.

The only thing that I’ve seen for certain to deal with grasshoppers is a shoe!
Those little SOBs are ironclad! Supposedly, there are certain plants that keep other bugs away (rosemary, marigolds, etc.). Grasshoppers eat them!

One of the most effective bug sprays is made from an extract from chrysanthemums. I’ve found the little bastards eating the buds from the mums! It’s like they have no off switch.

I do the grasshopper dance at least 5 times a day! It’s like the green apple quickstep only you’re aiming for the jumping bug rather than trying not to crap on your own feet!

Maybe I need to spark up another bowl!

 

[Zen_seeker]

The only thing that I’ve seen for certain to deal with grasshoppers is a shoe!
Those little SOBs are ironclad! Supposedly, there are certain plants that keep other bugs away (rosemary, marigolds, etc.). Grasshoppers eat them!

One of the most effective bug sprays is made from an extract from chrysanthemums. I’ve found the little bastards eating the buds from the mums! It’s like they have no off switch.

I do the grasshopper dance at least 5 times a day! It’s like the green apple quickstep only you’re aiming for the jumping bug rather than trying not to crap on your own feet!

Maybe I need to spark up another bowl!

We get the occasional grasshopper I notice in the yard. Haven’t seen one in a few years. Wife said she saw one last week but I think it was a type of cricket.

Moth caterpillars, leaf hoppers, aphids are the usual problems. I’ve only used Safer’s this year as I see the bugs but it’s been a pretty easy fight this year. I think the lack of rain might even be helping.

We still get a lot of cicadas but not like a couple years ago.

Around 2000 we had a big bloom of praying mantis. Big green one I saw on the subway hanging off the door and a couple of 1” and 2” green or brown ones around the bushes in our yard. Don’t remember seeing them as a kid in the city and I haven’t noticed any since. To bad, I’m cool with them and don’t just spray poisons around the yard. So not sure why they are so scarce.

 

[Tremojem]

The Praying Mantis rules.

 

[TomH]

All plants are in full stretch mode.
Indica, Blackberry moonshine is 54”x39”x39”
Hybrid, Super blue dream 1 is 56”x36”x32”
Hybrid Super blue dream 2 is 62”x39”x36”
Sativa, KC Wolfenstein is 66”x48”x36”

I think all but the indica are finished stretching, but I could be mistaken.

I can see bud sites adding mass now, very early but definitely changed mode.

14 hours and 6 minutes of light in the day. It’s only about 39 minutes less than the longest day of our year.

 

[steamroller]

I have always thought 14 hours is the trigger point.
It is amazing to me how short our days really are compared to how we run lighting.

 

[TomH]

I have always thought 14 hours is the trigger point.
It is amazing to me how short our days really are compared to how we run lighting.

Yeah, it makes me now know why things can go south quickly with lighting changes, even though they were staying over 12 hours. It seems more like the decrease in light over time is important too!

 

[steamroller]

I have slow flipped many times changing time by only an hour a week going from 18 to 12.
In the 6 weeks that takes you don't notice as much of a stretch as compared to a better stockier grow IMO.
I have slow flipped much faster than 1 hour a week and still think it adds something.

 

[TomH]

I put this in the wrong location initially, moved!


Plants are still gaining mass. The Super Blue Dream (x2) and KC Wolfenstein are about 10“ higher than my fence Now.

I dropped scrog nets over them after laying down across them (minimal hyperbole), I was literally arms up, leaning over on them as I gently bent the tops over. Now about 6” Below fence, so that helped but they pop through the nets regularly and gain altitude rapidly. I’m pushing it under the net a few times a day.

They all have that rich green look in the growth points, rapid growth look where nitrogen can’t get to the new growth rapidly enough and it just looks BRIGHT.

This past Sunday I trimmed about 5 lbs of mass from the three largest plants. Can’t even tell anything happened now! They are rapidly gaining mass. I’ll need to scrub the lower legs to get rid of stragler buds that are out of the light zone. I guess that’ll come about mid Aug.

 

[TomH]

Flower stage fully engaged.

I had to do some serious crunching on the sativa to keep it down. It’s a tall plant by nature. It wants to get big.

Super blue dream clones are the furthest along but all solidly in week two.

Indica, on the hill, suddenly got very puffy little buds. Fun to watch grow.

All doubled their hydration requirements for the stretch.

 

[BlueCollarBob]

Umm... Damn! Big, healthy plants everywhere. Looks like you're heading towards a big Fall harvest.

 

[TomH]

Umm... Damn! Big, healthy plants everywhere. Looks like you're heading towards a big Fall harvest.

I’m hoping so.

The Super Blue Dream are clones from the plant on the hills last year. It’s our main smoke for both my daughter and me and we still have move than a pound left. I’m hoping I can get a few more percent of THC if they go a week or three longer. I don’t expect that the two plants will provide as much as the plant last year, but it was a monster. The aroma of this stuff is like a fresh baked blueberry muffin. I’ve never encountered any weed with this powerful of an aroma. Great daytime weed.

The KC Wolfenstein (sativa) and Blackberry Moonshine (indica) are just making my drool thinking about.

A lot of grasshoppers earlier in the season, I haven’t seen any for a week or two. That helps a lot, those SOBs can turn trees into toothpicks quickly. It’s amazing how much one of those things can eat.

I’m spraying regularly to keep bugs at bay. Canna control, BT, Spynosad. Worms/caterpillars were a problem last year. I really want to avoid that issue again.

 

[BlueCollarBob]

I’m hoping so.

The Super Blue Dream are clones from the plant on the hills last year. It’s our main smoke for both my daughter and me and we still have move than a pound left. I’m hoping I can get a few more percent of THC if they go a week or three longer. I don’t expect that the two plants will provide as much as the plant last year, but it was a monster. The aroma of this stuff is like a fresh baked blueberry muffin. I’ve never encountered any weed with this powerful of an aroma. Great daytime weed.

The KC Wolfenstein (sativa) and Blackberry Moonshine (indica) are just making my drool thinking about.

A lot of grasshoppers earlier in the season, I haven’t seen any for a week or two. That helps a lot, those SOBs can turn trees into toothpicks quickly. It’s amazing how much one of those things can eat.

I’m spraying regularly to keep bugs at bay. Canna control, BT, Spynosad. Worms/caterpillars were a problem last year. I really want to avoid that issue again.

That Super Blue Dream is one that I've never been around, but sounds right up my alley. Just getting started and there are so many seeds I'd like to try. I can see how easy it can be to collect more than you can grow, if you don't show restraint or just grow more, lol. Ideally, it would be nice to land on some keepers and get to know them very well.

To be 2,800 miles apart, it seems our seasons are pretty similar. Not grasshopper damage here, but I have been trying to stay ahead of the caterpillars, too. Septoria was my biggest fail. I could have stayed ahead of that, but dropped the ball.

Are the grasshoppers something you have to deal with every year? I've seen some here, but in low numbers. Some years there are a lot. Especially a type we just call "flying grasshoppers". I've never tried to look up their real name, but they can be thick on some years.

 

[TomH]

That Super Blue Dream is one that I've never been around, but sounds right up my alley. Just getting started and there are so many seeds I'd like to try. I can see how easy it can be to collect more than you can grow, if you don't show restraint or just grow more, lol. Ideally, it would be nice to land on some keepers and get to know them very well.

To be 2,800 miles apart, it seems our seasons are pretty similar. Not grasshopper damage here, but I have been trying to stay ahead of the caterpillars, too. Septoria was my biggest fail. I could have stayed ahead of that, but dropped the ball.

Are the grasshoppers something you have to deal with every year? I've seen some here, but in low numbers. Some years there are a lot. Especially a type we just call "flying grasshoppers". I've never tried to look up their real name, but they can be thick on some years.

I’ve only been in the foothills for a little over 3 years now, so I don’t know the patterns yet but the first year was hotter than mercury’s ass! I think we 110+ for days in a row several times. Anything not in the shade would soon sizzle. No grasshoppers.

The second year was the rainiest SOB possible, then it was a cold july and august and a scorching september and october. it was a wild year. It was followed by what looked like a biblical plague of grasshoppers. Fortunately, they never took to wings (Or at least very few did). The ground based plagues seemed to stay to the west of us, there is a small lake that they had to go around and that seems to have kept that group away. Being that there are so many farms and orchards in this area, I’m sure it’s a regular thing here!

This past year, good rains, not a terribly cold winter nor hot start to summer (which worries me). I’m wondering if we’re going to get our heat at the end of summer??

We seemed to have a lot of small to medium sized hoppers eating everything. I sprayed a few different things and haven’t seen them in a month or two. I don’t know if that is a seasonal thing or if I stumbled on the secret? Probably not that latter!

I too find it interesting when similar climates exist in such different areas.
One thing I’m starting to notice, I grew tomatoes in pots and in the ground this year! Ground based plants have much better flavor! Same type of tomatoes, just better from Mother Earth! That should tell us all something.

Maybe I’ll start mixing a few handfulls of local soil into my next grow mix! We have really red soil, I’m guessing tons of iron.

I should test the soil sometime, I‘ve never done it even though I bought a kit a few years ago.

 

[TomH]

I’m looking forward to getting back to the foothills farm. Been away since Saturday, figure I’m missing a lot of mid flower growth. I hope I planned it well enough with amendments to finish the stretch and early flower needs.

I’ll be back on Saturday to adjust nutrients if needed or just stay out of the way if everything looks happy!

This return trip will be about the right time to begin clearing out the middle buds that are only going to draw energy from the tops.

Before I left on Saturday, I noticed that the indica (blackberry moonshine) was already boasting some trichomes. Well before the stretch is over which seems wickedly early. I hope that is a sign of good things to come. Rubbing green branches on all plants elicits an amazing set of aromas. Lemony sativas, blueberry from Super Blue Dream and something I can’t put my finger on from the indica, it’s really tasty smelling but I can’t identify it.

 

[Zen_seeker]

I’ve only been in the foothills for a little over 3 years now, so I don’t know the patterns yet but the first year was hotter than mercury’s ass! I think we 110+ for days in a row several times. Anything not in the shade would soon sizzle. No grasshoppers.

The second year was the rainiest SOB possible, then it was a cold july and august and a scorching september and october. it was a wild year. It was followed by what looked like a biblical plague of grasshoppers. Fortunately, they never took to wings (Or at least very few did). The ground based plagues seemed to stay to the west of us, there is a small lake that they had to go around and that seems to have kept that group away. Being that there are so many farms and orchards in this area, I’m sure it’s a regular thing here!

This past year, good rains, not a terribly cold winter nor hot start to summer (which worries me). I’m wondering if we’re going to get our heat at the end of summer??

We seemed to have a lot of small to medium sized hoppers eating everything. I sprayed a few different things and haven’t seen them in a month or two. I don’t know if that is a seasonal thing or if I stumbled on the secret? Probably not that latter!

I too find it interesting when similar climates exist in such different areas.
One thing I’m starting to notice, I grew tomatoes in pots and in the ground this year! Ground based plants have much better flavor! Same type of tomatoes, just better from Mother Earth! That should tell us all something.

Maybe I’ll start mixing a few handfulls of local soil into my next grow mix! We have really red soil, I’m guessing tons of iron.

I should test the soil sometime, I‘ve never done it even though I bought a kit a few years ago.

Just heard grasshoppers are bad in Alberta this year. Not sure how they deal with them. People’s lawns just gone over night.

 

[TomH]

Just heard grasshoppers are bad in Alberta this year. Not sure how they deal with them. People’s lawns just gone over night.

That’s just heart breaking. There were stories from people not many miles from us that got that treatment last year. Some of the pictures just made me sick! A gorgeous yard looked like post Armageddon when it was over!

There is apparently a very effective and reliable substance made from a bacteria that turns off something in the gut of the nymph hoppers. Its spread with cornmeal to get them to eat and they just shut down.

However, the only place that made the stuff, burned down in 2023. I’m not sure if they have been able to restart or ??? But I couldn’t buy the stuff last year when I was looking. Used garlic oil. It works sorta, and smells awesome!