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"Send in the clones" Bagseed Redux SOG

WeedRider

WeedRider

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No time to mess around with plumbing and whatnot. Cleaned the lung room and tent then got these clones started yesterday. Will let them run for a couple weeks then flip SOG-style. Still have the mother going which has a couple more clones to give then it's done. Might be able to get one more plant in here before the flip.

SendInTheClones.jpg

Gonna keep the EC much lower this time and will rig up a siphon water-top up system. Worked on the overflow sensor tonight, a couple NPN transistors in a darlington array have that sensing properly even at just 8ms/cm conductivity.
Screenshot_2023-10-05_23-20-48.png
 
WeedRider said:
No time to mess around with plumbing and whatnot. Cleaned the lung room and tent then got these clones started yesterday. Will let them run for a couple weeks then flip SOG-style. Still have the mother going which has a couple more clones to give then it's done. Might be able to get one more plant in here before the flip.

View attachment 24199

Gonna keep the EC much lower this time and will rig up a siphon water-top up system. Worked on the overflow sensor tonight, a couple NPN transistors in a darlington array have that sensing properly even at just 8ms/cm conductivity.
View attachment 24200
Click to expand...
Neat.

Love the read out, gotta get my self there one day
 
Where did you find those flat top totes?

What is the overflow sensor for? Like an auto top off?

An easy way to do a water change would be to drop a little pump thru one of the holes and run a hose to the drain. Couple minutes and you would be empty, then reverse the flow and put the pump in your water source. You could probably do it and not spill a drop.

$8

 
WeedRider said:
No time to mess around with plumbing and whatnot. Cleaned the lung room and tent then got these clones started yesterday. Will let them run for a couple weeks then flip SOG-style. Still have the mother going which has a couple more clones to give then it's done. Might be able to get one more plant in here before the flip.

View attachment 24199

Gonna keep the EC much lower this time and will rig up a siphon water-top up system. Worked on the overflow sensor tonight, a couple NPN transistors in a darlington array have that sensing properly even at just 8ms/cm conductivity.
View attachment 24200
Click to expand...
Love the monitor display. Gotta get with you to setup a sensor suite.
 
Moe.Red said:
Where did you find those flat top totes?

What is the overflow sensor for? Like an auto top off?

An easy way to do a water change would be to drop a little pump thru one of the holes and run a hose to the drain. Couple minutes and you would be empty, then reverse the flow and put the pump in your water source. You could probably do it and not spill a drop.

$8

Click to expand...

Tote was from Walmart. They have a nice rubber seal around the top. Cheap under $20.

Overflow sensor is for main res in case sipon goes wonky. Dunno, something like input tube getting dislodged and the top-off res draining uncontrolled into the main res. Break the siphon to stop the worst of it.

I do have a small pump. And the main res has a lower drain so water changes aren't that difficult. Just need a siphon system to keep water level more consistent.
 
Not talking shit on anyone else's grows buts it nice to see some more "advanced" shit here.

Most seem to be soil besides a few OGs in coco or rockwool or fuckin ONE aerofogponics.

Few DWC/R

My 2c
 
Observer said:
Not talking shit on anyone else's grows buts it nice to see some more "advanced" shit here.

Most seem to be soil besides a few OGs in coco or rockwool or fuckin ONE aerofogponics.

Few DWC/R

My 2c
Click to expand...
Just gotta rub shoulders more. Some of the best hydro growers hang out here. Maybe not as flashy but they get results. I'm still a newb when it comes to grow experience.
 
WeedRider said:
Just gotta rub shoulders more. Some of the best hydro growers hang out here. Maybe not as flashy but they get results. I'm still a newb when it comes to grow experience.
Click to expand...
agree, me as well im just seemingly learning it somewhat quickly, determined to.

do you mind elaborating on how you sat that up? or just show some pics and ill figure it out?

or keywords to google


the digital read out, ofc ive seen it before but here we are again.
 
Observer said:
do you mind elaborating on how you sat that up? or just show some pics and ill figure it out?
Click to expand...

Sensors are ESP32 that send data every 5 min to Influxdb over http post commands. The dashboard component is called Chronograf. It reads data from InfluxDB which is a time series database. Kapacitor is used for sending commands and alerting. All of it running on an OrangePi acting as a WiFI hotspot. The most difficult part is writing the firmware for the sensors. The rest is just Linux software.
 
WeedRider said:
Sensors are ESP32 that send data every 5 min to Influxdb over http post commands. The dashboard component is called Chronograf. It reads data from InfluxDB which is a time series database. Kapacitor is used for sending commands and alerting. All of it running on an OrangePi acting as a WiFI hotspot. The most difficult part is writing the firmware for the sensors. The rest is just Linux software.
Click to expand...
We need to have an off board conversation. I'm doing a lot of the same stuff slightly differently.

At the moment I am 3D printing a humidifier. Putting controls in it would be cool.
 
Flipped the tent today. Not so much a SOG anymore as one plant manifolded into 4 nodes pretty nicely. The others are coming along but I really ready to ditch the whole B1 line, still showing stunted growth while the other plant is exploding. Need to pop some new seeds. I want to try the vertical germination method I saw here looks legit.

The gravity feed siphon top-off system has been a complete failure so far. I tried to use .7" drip irrigation tubing but all the fittings are 90 deg bends and the air bubbles get caught. Thinking I will switch to an active refill system. I've got a pump, water sensor and ultrasonic distance sensor that should do the job. I really need a water level sensor anyway so 'get two birds stoned at once' as Ricky would say.

Sorry I haven't been posting updates much, been busy.
 
Things are coming along Ok. Actually have a nice canopy going, did a bit of defoliation in the middle. The B1 clones have shot up compared to the big plant in the middle. The big plant has been kind of stunted, I think the net cups are too small? The clay balls were seriously wedged against the trunk and that can't be good.
DSC_1148.jpg

pH isn't nearly as stable at this lower EC. Hoping the water top-off system will help stabilize things.
specs.png

Progress on the water top-off system is going well. I have the ultrasonic sensor working just need to work on the program logic for actually filling the res. Gotta make sure it is bulletproof first or there will be water on the floor.
 
Well things have gone to shit like usual. Dunno guess my pH pen was off. The S.A. pH probe hasn't been working reliably either. Need to calibrate it again. Nanners everywhere another fucked grow.

Have some commercial seeds going for the next crop. Ordered some pH drops maybe that will work reliably.
 
WeedRider said:
Have some commercial seeds going for the next crop. Ordered some pH drops maybe that will work reliably.
Click to expand...
Man, that's a huge bummer, your plants were looking soooo good! Are you sure it's the pH that is causing your hermie issues?

I would think it might lean more toward the genetics. I don't know what you are using but I found that getting the best genetics you can find takes care of a lot of issues.
 
SweetLeafGrow said:
Man, that's a huge bummer, your plants were looking soooo good! Are you sure it's the pH that is causing your hermie issues?

I would think it might lean more toward the genetics. I don't know what you are using but I found that getting the best genetics you can find takes care of a lot of issues.
Click to expand...

I can't rule out genetics, these were really old bag seeds. Hoping the commercial seeds will do better. But pH has been harder to keep steady with the lower EC I've been running this grow. Still learning.
 
Have you ever used this chart?

2519-66bc3d634012fe5a9a80ff3cdc3a5de6.jpg


Using this method changed my game. If you need help, I'd be glad to assist if you decided to give it a try.
 
I've seen that. Most of the grow I was getting rising pH. Much better root growth than last time. The res is almost full of roots. Going to larger net baskets next time as well. These 4" seem to force the clay medium into the stems which can't be good.
 
If you want to try that chart, look at the EC first. What's it doing? Rising, falling, or remaining static? Then go to that section of the chart and ask now, what is the pH doing? Same question, rising, falling, static? Then, depending on what that pH is doing, the chart tells you what to do. I keep a daily log of notes on what the EC and pH numbers are so I can see it when it changes.

Rising pH doesn't tell you much by itself. But when you combine it with the EC and follow that chart, it will teach you how to read the water. I don't know the science behind it, but there is a 3 way going on between the plant, the EC and the pH. The plant's needs will constantly change throughout their life and when you learn to read the water this way, the plants will tell you what they want. I'm no expert on this technique, but I've been using it for a couple of grows and I'm coming close to getting the hang of it, I know it works, my grows have never been better.

I also should mention, if you are using a 2nd res with an auto top off on a float valve to your main res, this technique will not work.
 
WeedRider said:
Going to larger net baskets next time as well. These 4" seem to force the clay medium into the stems which can't be good.
Click to expand...
I actually went from large net pots to the smaller 4" and they work just fine. I've had that stem and roots shred those net pots, don't seem to slow em down at all. Lets me get more water in my system too which is a plus.
 
WeedRider said:
I can't rule out genetics, these were really old bag seeds. Hoping the commercial seeds will do better. But pH has been harder to keep steady with the lower EC I've been running this grow. Still learning.
Click to expand...
The fact that there is any seed in the bag in the first place means there was pollen in the grow these seeds came from. If it was an attempt to grow without seeds, the parent(s) were hermies. Does not bode well for the offspring.
 
SweetLeafGrow said:
If you want to try that chart, look at the EC first. What's it doing? Rising, falling, or remaining static? Then go to that section of the chart and ask now, what is the pH doing? Same question, rising, falling, static? Then, depending on what that pH is doing, the chart tells you what to do. I keep a daily log of notes on what the EC and pH numbers are so I can see it when it changes.

Rising pH doesn't tell you much by itself. But when you combine it with the EC and follow that chart, it will teach you how to read the water. I don't know the science behind it, but there is a 3 way going on between the plant, the EC and the pH. The plant's needs will constantly change throughout their life and when you learn to read the water this way, the plants will tell you what they want. I'm no expert on this technique, but I've been using it for a couple of grows and I'm coming close to getting the hang of it, I know it works, my grows have never been better.

I also should mention, if you are using a 2nd res with an auto top off on a float valve to your main res, this technique will not work.
Click to expand...
Here's a screenshot of specs from the last 30 days. Ignore the absolute values and look at the trends. It's been pretty steady EC and nice rising 'ramps' for pH. Have been much better at maintaining these trends this grow but it still went sideways. Cannot rule out genetics (hopefully for my ego lol.) I am working on a water top-off system but not using it yet. Still experimental stage. Just basic DWC for now.

Screenshot_2023-12-29_16-52-19.png
 
Hard to tell from these stats what is going on without being able to zoom in on them and compare EC to pH from the same time stamp.

I understand what you mean about trends but I have found you don't need 30 days to see a trend in the water. The plant will immediately respond to whatever is in the water and that response comes in the form of more or less intake of water and nutrients and a corresponding rise or fall in pH. It happens pretty quickly. I have also found that very small changes in EC will show a "trend" that I need to pay attention to, which is why I like to use PPM, and that small change will affect the pH. The more you are off on EC from what the plant wants, the faster the pH will swing on you. It's a very small window that gets you in that perfect or near perfect balance. Once you find the sweet spot, that pH will sit rock solid until the needs of the plant changes and then once again, the water will tell you what to do. It's a balancing act, especially when you get into flower when the needs are changing much more often to the harvest.

How often are you changing out your res? What nutrients are you using?
 
I took a closer look at this image-

specs-png.29851


Hard to see it, but that EC is definitely trending down over that 6 day period. You said the pH really went haywire, rising. You also made the comment that you were using a lower EC. This tells me the plants wanted more nutrients, check the chart, EC falling, pH rising, chart says raise the EC by .1
 
Water changes have been about once a month. At 19 days right now. Using Masterblend tomato mix.

My first grow I had EC around 2000 but got advice here saying that was much too high. This grow I've been trying to keep it around 1200. Seemed to work great until I flipped them or just after. I use EC because on my meters it offers the same precision as PPM but no conversion scales to worry about. I do understand some meters artificially limit the precision of EC mode in which case you'd want to use PPM. It would be easier to maintain a stable pH with a bit more buffering.
 
WeedRider said:
Well things have gone to shit like usual. Dunno guess my pH pen was off. The S.A. pH probe hasn't been working reliably either. Need to calibrate it again. Nanners everywhere another fucked grow.

Have some commercial seeds going for the next crop. Ordered some pH drops maybe that will work reliably.
Click to expand...
I use ph strips from the fish guys cheap accurate and never fails - sorry u science guys but fuck the 100$ pens ! Drops for the win
 
Finally got some pH drops and I'm not super convinced in their precision. I actually got two types and one is fairly close but the other is -1.5 off at least. Need to test more.

Chopped this grow at 12.5 weeks. Still not seeing a ton of amber trics but I've got a couple of commercial plants that are ready to flip anytime so I need to clear out the tent.

Is it possible to re-use this tent now that there has been so much pollen around?
I assume I should buy a new carbon filter?
Any way of de-activating pollen?

Chop day pics

Tub full of roots. Air stones were locked in place. Lower water temps this grow made a big difference.
DSC_1201.jpgDSC_1200.jpgDSC_1196.jpgDSC_1194.jpg
 
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