Newbs 1st grow! Complete failure or a "by the skin of my teeth" documentary 🤔🫣

[Rootsruler]

@Skinnypuppy80

When I saw you on that other site having issues and reading the responses you were getting I knew this place would be a great fit for what you want to do.

 

[moe.red]

Hey @moe.red glad the shot worked brother. Hope things are well.

personally i feel from a chemical reaction standpoint that there cannot be to much surface agitation, water column mixing or bubbling of a nutrient solution….. if we control the atmosphere above the water and for the most part if we dont also. What we need to do is make sure we are using the proper buffers. Eg not using bicarbonate because of the chemical reaction as you described.

A lot depends on the type of nutrients (forms used) and buffers as to the potential problems we may see when it comes to aeration

I think we might be making this harder to understand. We are kinda answering pipe’s question on this thread about RDWC. A barrel of nute water and a flowing fallponics system don’t behave identically.

Iirc pipe has a barrel in the garage that he circulates thru to lower temp. Is that right? Very seldom turn the pump on? And this is for the nutes that bottom feed the autopots with coco in them? Or maybe it’s pro mix.

He’s getting precipitation in that setup I think.

I think he is using gh flora but could be wrong.

 

[Pipecarver]

I think we might be making this harder to understand. We are kinda answering pipe’s question on this thread about RDWC. A barrel of nute water and a flowing fallponics system don’t behave identically.

Iirc pipe has a barrel in the garage that he circulates thru to lower temp. Is that right? Very seldom turn the pump on? And this is for the nutes that bottom feed the autopots with coco in them? Or maybe it’s pro mix.

He’s getting precipitation in that setup I think.

I think he is using gh flora but could be wrong.

"

Iirc pipe has a barrel in the garage that he circulates thru to lower temp. Is that right? Very seldom turn the pump on? And this is for the nutes that bottom feed the autopots with coco in them? Or maybe it’s pro mix.

My 10 gal reservoir is in my basement and in summer months it needs cooling but through winter it sits in a 68f room. I got a lot of Chelates and precipitation of nutes with the air stones. Less with just a circulating pump and chiller, even less without the chiller. I do use 100% GH nutes in Promix/perlite and Autopots.

I was commenting on the amount of build up with an air stone,( way too much) without airstones, with a chiller and without a chiller. I find I get less build up with less interaction and was wondering if nutes moving through impellers constantly would add more or less build up. I'm only moving the nutes around for 3 min/hr now rather than 24/7 through my chiller and I seem to have less of a build up. I'm not sure if its the movement or what but less is better than more...

 

[moe.red]

"

My 10 gal reservoir is in my basement and in summer months it needs cooling but through winter it sits in a 68f room. I got a lot of Chelates and precipitation of nutes with the air stones. Less with just a circulating pump and chiller, even less without the chiller. I do use 100% GH nutes in Promix/perlite and Autopots.

I was commenting on the amount of build up with an air stone,( way too much) without airstones, with a chiller and without a chiller. I find I get less build up with less interaction and was wondering if nutes moving through impellers constantly would add more or less build up. I'm only moving the nutes around for 3 min/hr now rather than 24/7 through my chiller and I seem to have less of a build up. I'm not sure if its the movement or what but less is better than more...

Buddy I don’t think so on the impeller but could be wrong. In RDWC we run pumps 24x7 and it does not build up for me at least.

 

[Aqua Man]

I think we might be making this harder to understand. We are kinda answering pipe’s question on this thread about RDWC. A barrel of nute water and a flowing fallponics system don’t behave identically.

Iirc pipe has a barrel in the garage that he circulates thru to lower temp. Is that right? Very seldom turn the pump on? And this is for the nutes that bottom feed the autopots with coco in them? Or maybe it’s pro mix.

He’s getting precipitation in that setup I think.

I think he is using gh flora but could be wrong.

Ahh i didn’t read the back story at all… makes sense

 

[Aqua Man]

Anything involving organics will need more cleaning. The better the environment the faster the growth of all organics and microorganisms. Ao its not a bad thing but rather a maintenance schedule thing. This is a lesser issue with sterile setups

 

[Pipecarver]

Buddy I don’t think so on the impeller but could be wrong. In RDWC we run pumps 24x7 and it does not build up for me at least.

Not just the impellers the whole pump housing gets coated. I wasn't sure if it was typical or not, I'm just seeing less grit now than in the past and the only difference now is I'm not running it through a chiller and its not being pumped 24/7 through it.

Alls good. I have a bitch about PPFD numbers next. We don't grow in 2D and the PPFD is shown as a flat field. I grow in 3D, I suppose it is a truer reading with a Scrog grow but with buds growing down from 6-8 inches - 24 inches away from the lights what good is it to be confused with a chart that is in 2D.....

I'm sorry to have hacked your thread here but I'm old and just received news of a 25% tariff. Does this mean we're at war? Fk just when I was getting comfortable with your funny accent & we get into a trade war...Fk who needs this shit? I know its going to cost me money one way or the other.

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

@Skinnypuppy80

When I saw you on that other site having issues and reading the responses you were getting I knew this place would be a great fit for what you want to do.

Yeah dude, pretty sure u saved me quite the headache. In my downtime, I tend to read others threads hoping some of the knowledge there will sink in at some point lol

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

Ugh, another hr or so b4 I can check on the ladies. On my days off, I'm always in their business, probably doing more harm than good lol I do have a consistent RH around 60% though w being able to have the exhaust on(lvl 1 so far) and all air flaps open. I'm hoping I'll c an improvement w growth compared to having no flaps open, and 0 exhaust. Now that keeping the RH up is no longer a problem, should I b turning up the exhaust to like 3 or 4 on the aci controller? I'm probably nitpicking here, but I have a tendency to over think just about everything haha

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

I think all is going well? Lights on, air temp around 75, RH 60%, leaf temp 72, and got the water temp down to 71 just by removing the res lid!
Took a video that kind of shows current stage of the tent, maybe the link will work?

https://imgur.com/a/xy0w2s7

 

[Pipecarver]

I think all is going well? Lights on, air temp around 75, RH 60%, leaf temp 72, and got the water temp down to 71 just by removing the res lid!
Took a video that kind of shows current stage of the tent, maybe the link will work?

https://imgur.com/a/xy0w2s7

Hey, air temp could be a bit higher optimal leaf temp is 78f, I'm around 75f myself, It cost me too much to be in the 80's to get my leaf temps up but I aim for it when I can get it. You don't want light into your res, covering it up may add some heat but light and nutes don't mix well together and you'll get more biofilm

 

[Rootsruler]

Not just the impellers the whole pump housing gets coated. I wasn't sure if it was typical or not, I'm just seeing less grit now than in the past and the only difference now is I'm not running it through a chiller and its not being pumped 24/7 through it.

Alls good. I have a bitch about PPFD numbers next. We don't grow in 2D and the PPFD is shown as a flat field. I grow in 3D, I suppose it is a truer reading with a Scrog grow but with buds growing down from 6-8 inches - 24 inches away from the lights what good is it to be confused with a chart that is in 2D.....

I'm sorry to have hacked your thread here but I'm old and just received news of a 25% tariff. Does this mean we're at war? Fk just when I was getting comfortable with your funny accent & we get into a trade war...Fk who needs this shit? I know its going to cost me money one way or the other.

While I'm a ScrOGer, when I free grew I would measure PPFD at the top and bottom of the plant and average the two.

 

[Pipecarver]

While I'm a ScrOGer, when I free grew I would measure PPFD at the top and bottom of the plant and average the two.

And what did that get you other than a bunch of numbers in your head? could you use those numbers?

The map numbers are just an advertising gimmick to me, make it confusing and it must be a good light with all that technical shit attached.

I was recently looking at lights and they all seem to have the same specs with different map numbers using the same diodes. I went with China made cheap and the numbers were impressive....lol...

Is there really a difference in growth with higher end lights, I'm in the $400 range but some run into the $1500 range

 

[Rootsruler]

And what did that get you other than a bunch of numbers in your head?

Data to use to adjust my lighting.

could you use those numbers?

Yes

The map numbers are just an advertising gimmick to me, make it confusing and it must be a good light with all that technical shit attached.

I was recently looking at lights and they all seem to have the same specs with different map numbers using the same diodes. I went with China made cheap and the numbers were impressive....lol...

Is there really a difference in growth with higher end lights, I'm in the $400 range but some run into the $1500 range

Almost all the manufacturers use the same map in their designs so there really isn't any advantage between one or the other unless you are manipulating your spectrum like you can with California Lightworks gear. Youtube has some good videos documenting what the manufacturers are claiming and from what I can see most are pretty close.

Diodes are just one piece of the puzzle when it comes to grow lights. Driver, power supply, etc. will influence the light output. Even the type of potentiometers they use for dimmers can make a difference.

Is there a big difference between them? I agree with you. No real difference for most home growers. Even if there was would most home growers be able to use it? Most growers have no idea what the different spectrums do or how to use them.

I've been using Bestva lights for decades without issue. I've run many different grows with all the main brands like Mars, SpiderFarmer, etc. Never really saw a difference in dry yields.

Snow Skiers tend to like to buy the newest out there. I'm not one of those. I have skis that are more than 30 years old and they turn and stop just fine. Just like skiing, what's most important is skill and being able to max the performance of the gear you are using. It is rare that I get on a lift with someone that is decked out in the latest gear that can actually live up to the performance they're wearing. I usually get to watch them pizza slice it all the way down the mountain.

 

[Chemistry]

One thing people forget when using air pumps, is that they produce heat, a lot of heat, the bigger the pump the more heat they produce, and this is will transfer to your water. When I was into hydro I gave up worrying about the heat. I just ran my pumps every now and then, that kept my water temps just perfect. One thing that is most important is to run with a good enzyme to keep your water right.

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

I'm really not confident on when and where to trim. I believe the auto needs like 30% reduction, including lower sites? The photos r progessing way quicker than I imagined they would, better husbandry this go round i guess. Water changes 4 both systems tmrw. The auto is just over 10 wks, photos at like 4 wks.

 

[moe.red]

I’m not an auto guy but I don’t think you crop fim or really even trim autos?

Too early for a haircut on the photos. Especially if you need rh to be higher.

It’s time to start thinking about the flip. Ease up the cal mag proportions on your water change. I see a single brown spot on a fan that could be where you dripped but it could also be calcium. RDWC tends to show more of the calcium deficiency issues common at flip than soil. Because the plants are growing so fast.

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

I’m not an auto guy but I don’t think you crop fim or really even trim autos?

Too early for a haircut on the photos. Especially if you need rh to be higher.

It’s time to start thinking about the flip. Ease up the cal mag proportions on your water change. I see a single brown spot on a fan that could be where you dripped but it could also be calcium. RDWC tends to show more of the calcium deficiency issues common at flip than soil. Because the plants are growing so fast.

View attachment 89288

View attachment 89289

Those spots started showing up on almost every plant. Did a little research and guessed it was cal deficiency? Dosed both systems w like 100-150 ppm cal-mag 2 days ago, and they all started growing like weeds! I'm thinking I need a different nute recipe, or just add when I see the deficiency again?

How do I know when to flip? I was gonna go off the age, like 7-8 weeks of veg? The photos r just shy a day of 4 weeks of veg.
I appreciate your advice and all the other ppl here. I guess I need to make more trial/errors and such so I can read the plants better.

Do u top, fim, or just defoliate? I was under the impression topping or fimming helps with yield

 

[smoke]

I’m not an auto guy but I don’t think you crop fim or really even trim autos?

Too early for a haircut on the photos. Especially if you need rh to be higher.

It’s time to start thinking about the flip. Ease up the cal mag proportions on your water change. I see a single brown spot on a fan that could be where you dripped but it could also be calcium. RDWC tends to show more of the calcium deficiency issues common at flip than soil. Because the plants are growing so fast.

View attachment 89288

View attachment 89289

Imo, that chart is too late for everything cannabis and is found here.

https://aptus-holland.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/Manual_AH20_UK.pdf

I use this chart created by bill farthing for cannabis.



I flip around week 7 or 8 and grow trees. I try to defoliate a few days before flip and top or fim at the same time , and don't touch them again until day 21 of flwr to remove more.

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

Imo, that chart is too late for everything cannabis and is found here.

https://aptus-holland.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/Manual_AH20_UK.pdf

I use this chart created by bill farthing for cannabis.

View attachment 89319

I flip around week 7 or 8 and grow trees. I try to defoliate a few days before flip and top or fim at the same time , and don't touch them again until day 21 of flwr to remove more.

Yeah, don't think my tent will hold the monsters u grow! Shit, if I grew like u, this house would turn into a 3 level lol Which means I should flip em soon like moe suggested

 

[moe.red]

I think the rules are different between photos and auto when it comes to scissors. Again I’m not an auto guy but I think the general advice is leave them alone. With photos shape them to what you want them to be.

In terms of the flip it comes down to how much room you have. If you look at smoke he is growing plants you need a ladder to tend to. I don’t think you have that kind of room. So flipping sooner means smaller plants in the end.

Right now calcium and nitrogen are the biggest nutes in play. That will change once you flip. But smoke is right you really need those spiking nutes going into the plant before the spike happens or you will show signs of deficiency

The thing about RDWC is it grows fast. That also means it can go badly pretty quickly. Need to stay ahead of the curve.

I said after the 4th node is the time to start looking at the flip. So we are there. Now is the time to get your calcium up and start bringing in flower nutes and micros like sulphur. Maybe show us the nute schedule you are following and we can make recommendations.

Once you feel you have the right water chemistry I would flip. The plants will still act like they are in veg for weeks as they adjust hormones and shoot up in the stretch. This is when the scaffolding gets built to hold giant buds. Calcium and silica facilitate that strong branching. This is also when you want to do lst via netting if you are going to scrog (might be tough with that auto in the way) and topping.

Can you post a breeder pic of the genetics you are growing to get an idea what to expect? Durban poison vs kush have different needs in terms of trimming so where are your plants on the size spectrum?

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

I think the rules are different between photos and auto when it comes to scissors. Again I’m not an auto guy but I think the general advice is leave them alone. With photos shape them to what you want them to be.

In terms of the flip it comes down to how much room you have. If you look at smoke he is growing plants you need a ladder to tend to. I don’t think you have that kind of room. So flipping sooner means smaller plants in the end.

Right now calcium and nitrogen are the biggest nutes in play. That will change once you flip. But smoke is right you really need those spiking nutes going into the plant before the spike happens or you will show signs of deficiency

The thing about RDWC is it grows fast. That also means it can go badly pretty quickly. Need to stay ahead of the curve.

I said after the 4th node is the time to start looking at the flip. So we are there. Now is the time to get your calcium up and start bringing in flower nutes and micros like sulphur. Maybe show us the nute schedule you are following and we can make recommendations.

Once you feel you have the right water chemistry I would flip. The plants will still act like they are in veg for weeks as they adjust hormones and shoot up in the stretch. This is when the scaffolding gets built to hold giant buds. Calcium and silica facilitate that strong branching. This is also when you want to do lst via netting if you are going to scrog (might be tough with that auto in the way) and topping.

Can you post a breeder pic of the genetics you are growing to get an idea what to expect? Durban poison vs kush have different needs in terms of trimming so where are your plants on the size spectrum?

I got the white widows from seedsupreme, here's what they say about growing it.

What i get from that is i need to flip soon. Do a water change today then flip tmrw is what I'm thinking I should do? Haven't changed water in the system yet, so long overdue
Yeah, that auto I should've scrogged differently, it shadows the most prominent plant i have of the photos. It still seems to be the clear, dominant plant of the 4 though, weird.

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

screenshot of nute mix i have been using

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

Salutations all! Hope all is well! Been horrid cold here, lows in the -30 to -40 for a few days Stuck inside for the most part due to sickness so hasn't been that bad to endure That also allows me to binge watch GOT(never watched it b4,) love being able to watch a full series without having to wait a week to see the next episode!

Onto the current happenings of the tent!
So, 4 days after the flip, cal deficiency(pics of photo)?


Is there a possibility of over dosing w calmag whilst trying to correct it?
I've been noticing pretty much through the whole grow of both systems, the ppm stays pretty consistent. Does that mean I nute locked them?

The dwc auto drinks about 3/4 gal a day and seems to be doing ok?


What a lovely smell when I open the tent door Currently my mammoth 8 mint led is 23 inches above the dwc canopy and at 90% I'm thinking maybe I should lower the height and the %? I'd be more than happy to take more pics if need be

Tent stays around 78° and 60% RH with vpd around 1.2 light on. Keep the dwc around 500 ppm, rdwc 340. Been adding calmagic when I c what I believe is cal deficiency.

Picture of the third biggest photo root system


Thanks for looking and any suggestions u may have!

 

[steamroller]

I don't see cal mag def.
Too much cal will lock out just about everything else.

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

I don't see cal mag def.
Too much cal will lock out just about everything else.
View attachment 89782

Thank u for the response! I don't think I took a close enough pics, same pics but zoomed in and circled what I was thinking is a deficiency... I'm probably overthinking as always.

 

[steamroller]

I would install mag without cal if possible.
Epsom salt is wonderful.
You are on top of things so it is not out of hand or deep yet.

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

I would install mag without cal if possible.
Epsom salt is wonderful.
You are on top of things so it is not out of hand or deep yet.

So how much epsom? It's close to a 50 gal system, so I assume more than just a "pinch." Probably shouldn't be adding the calmag as u suggested, and i won't. Thank u kind sir

 

[steamroller]

So how much epsom? It's close to a 50 gal system, so I assume more than just a "pinch." Probably shouldn't be adding the calmag as u suggested, and i won't. Thank u kind sir

The recommended dosage for Mag for weed is 5 mL per gallon of water. 5mL equals one teaspoon.
Some go as high as 10mL. or 2 teaspoons.

 

[Chemistry]

Your plants look ok, nice colour green. My advise to you would be, tread slowly, don't change to much at any one time, or if some thing goes wrong, you won't be able to work out which change is at fault. Save the technical stuff until you gain more experience. I made the same mistakes as you, I looked more at the internet than I did at my plants, plants will tell you every thing you need to know, listening to them is the hardest lesson.

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

Your plants look ok, nice colour green. My advise to you would be, tread slowly, don't change to much at any one time, or if some thing goes wrong, you won't be able to work out which change is at fault. Save the technical stuff until you gain more experience. I made the same mistakes as you, I looked more at the internet than I did at my plants, plants will tell you every thing you need to know, listening to them is the hardest lesson.

Yeah, I tend to overthink things instead of applying the KISS method. Tis hard though, my mind is constantly captivated w this new hobby! I check ppm, ph, rh, vpd, waterlevels, overall plant growth/conditions, and enjoy lovely smell emanating once I open the tent door on a daily basis lol I'm doing ok for a first grow I think? but yes, I should step back and quit meddling, and get a successful first harvest to which I can build upon. U all make that hard as fuck though w seeing all of this sites diaries lol Appreciate ur response

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

Hello all!! This mo-fo of a grow is starting to get out of control! Was hoping to have removed the auto by now, it's taking up too much space/light atm I believe lol. It's hard to see by the pics, but it looks to me that the photos and the auto r having a turf war over space/light haha


Below pics are of the auto. Probably another week or two b4 I see mostly milk and some amber?



I wanna chop that mofo SO BAD! I believe it's hindering the other 4 in their stretch, but it's soo very hard to it when I believe it's just a few weeks away from prime time. This auto was soo mishandled. Twas fimmed in a small tent and had rot going up into the stem, so I don't want to abandon it when it's soo close. I dunno, I think I'm gonna push it and c where it's at in a week. Plus side, I'm getting in some "tent yoga" trying to manage the photos lol

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

A friend came by and checked out my tent and said the plant in that last pics of the photos is a male
Light just went out so I'm gonna have to wait till tmrw to get that heathen out and switch one of the other photos into that site which has the most room to grow... fucking nanners, balls r disgusting

 

[Chemistry]

A friend came by and checked out my tent and said the plant in that last pics of the photos is a male View attachment 90522
Light just went out so I'm gonna have to wait till tmrw to get that heathen out and switch one of the other photos into that site which has the most room to grow... fucking nanners, balls r disgusting

Looks like a composter.

 

[steamroller]

It does look like a male in the photo.
A better pic would be helpful but it does look like balls.

 

[freezeland]

A friend came by and checked out my tent and said the plant in that last pics of the photos is a male View attachment 90522
Light just went out so I'm gonna have to wait till tmrw to get that heathen out and switch one of the other photos into that site which has the most room to grow... fucking nanners, balls r disgusting

Kill it. Mist it down before you chop it. Turn the fans off too when removing it from the tent.

 

[Skinnypuppy80]

Nasty balls going in the bin!


Now I have an empty site I'm assuming at this point, its not a good idea to try and fill that site. Could be worse though? lol

 

[Aqua Man]

Nasty balls going in the bin!
View attachment 90557View attachment 90558

Now I have an empty site I'm assuming at this point, its not a good idea to try and fill that site. Could be worse though? lol

Happens just cover the site so no light gets in

 

[doublej]

Poor guy...he looks good