Stoney's Soil vs Hydro Apple Fritter Auto show

[GrumpAzz]

you're right i need to just pick the pen i trust and roll with it. it's why i bought a good one, i figured it was more important to know my ph more accurately than my nutrient level

Yeah just pick one. I have two bluelab guardian monitors and they're off from each other by .2. They were both off from my bluelab pen as well. I figured .2 is close enough, though. They both get calibrated at the same time in the same juice in the same little beaker.

 

[Stoneyluv]

Yeah just pick one. I have two bluelab guardian monitors and they're off from each other by .2. They were both off from my bluelab pen as well. I figured .2 is close enough, though. They both get calibrated at the same time in the same juice in the same little beaker.

you're right, second guessing it to much. the pen i have is close enough and i trust it more than the color card right now. i haven't used any down yet so with the orca, king carb, nova, and cal/mag it's at 5.8-6.0 so i just put some down in a jug and got it to 3.0 and poured a quart of that in my water to see. i have a couple days to figure it out and get it right before the seedlings are ready. i see coly leaves though!!!!!!

so just being nosy, why do you have two guardians? is one for you top off container?

 

[GrumpAzz]

so just being nosy, why do you have two guardians? is one for you top off container?

Yeah. After my first grow, I wanted to know what I was topping off with and now I keep the two as close as possible. Seems to be working well so far and, in doing so, I can use this chart.

 

[smoke]

 

[Zen_seeker]

 

[GrumpAzz]

View attachment 69194

I've seen this chart before but never read that one little bit.

"It's like keeping a horse! But you can't smoke a horse."

 

[moe.red]

Mdk is the one that did the side by side. Great review.

Now I want a duckie too.

 

[Stoneyluv]

Yeah. After my first grow, I wanted to know what I was topping off with and now I keep the two as close as possible. Seems to be working well so far and, in doing so, I can use this chart.
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wow thanks both of you guys, these are both getting printed and hung on my new dork board!!!

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thats some serious IV work!!! thats gotta suck on bottle filling day!!

Mdk is the one that did the side by side. Great review.

Now I want a duckie too.

sweet thanks!! if i get anything of anything i'm going to ask him and his wife to honor us again in a smoke test!!!!!

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my pH is still a little high yet, i mixed more of the 3.0 water and added another quart. for one my EC level is a tad bit higher than i want so i thought adding water would dilute that a tiny bit and also it seems like a little water evaporated out over the past three days?.
not sure if this is possible? nothing leaked, no water on the floors...

either way i added some 3.0 ph water...

my pump controller fell off the wall already, the adhesive fell off of their stuff not the wood.. shame shame!!!! i used some good 3M stuff so i'm good.



so to mix my solutions i have been cranking up the variable pump. on high it exchanges once every thirty seconds and on low about once every 4 minutes.

i need to get some soil mixed up tonight.... because it is time to get this show on the road!!!!!!



seven for seven... the two tiny ones are gonna stay there till tomorrow and they're going outside in my polytunnel. the two biggest one are going in soil and the next two biggest ones are going in hydro, the smallest of those five is going in the one gallon jug laying in there ( gotta make some holes yet!!)

and this is what i am rolling with... @GrumpAzz is this the ratios you went with on day one?



i'll reset the calendar to day one once i get them all in tonight... picks after OP live and Freddy and Juan's gold rescue!!!

 

[Stoneyluv]

soil: mixed crab and lobster shell with stonington and watered in with great white, king crab, and green aminos
hydro: put seedlings in washed hydroton. water has floranova grow, orca, king crab, cal/mag - ppm: 256 pH: 5.6

 

[GrumpAzz]

and this is what i am rolling with... @GrumpAzz is this the ratios you went with on day one?

I ran 4:5:10 for a week and then 8:10:20 for a week. Then I hit them with 10:20:20 and right now they're at 25:50:50

 

[SiamSam]

soil: mixed crab and lobster shell with stonington and watered in with great white, king crab, and green aminos
hydro: put seedlings in washed hydroton. water has floranova grow, orca, king crab, cal/mag - ppm: 256 pH: 5.6

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Keep the shiny side up and the greasy side down, steady as she goes.

 

[Bandit420]

i was thinking maybe a boat or submarine, but nope got me a ducky!! .. maybe i should have gotten a toy aquaman!!! shhh.. don't tell him i said that.. he'll stop helping with my nutrient solution!! AM has been a great help with getting my ingredients sorted and dosages and tons of great info on how to learn it going forward myself the right way. i have zero hydro habits right now so if i never pick up any bad habits i'll only know the correct way! the easy part on me is most of you helping me all seem to agree on most things, of coarse not every single thing but shit who does with anything!

i feel as prepared as i possible can be at this point and just can't wait for their heads to pop up!! i haven't looked yet today soooo...



Oh man that is a collection of all kinds of awesome hydration, for me and plants!!! you got my tail wagging for sure my man!!

i don't need any of those 4" inch air stones though, i have a few here.. one even has a ring of led's around it!!!!

that is a good tip man, it's every bit of $30 w/tax. might be yet another thing i add to the prime sale list!! batteries, band-aids, and floranova!!

ya know when i first opened the bottle i spilled a little on the floor, i went oooo don't get this on your clothes!!!! i already have tiny dots sprayed on the lid already.. sloppy sloppy!! it's weird though once it's mixed with water it makes the water look like mud, then a little while longer it lightens up and looks lighter than iced tea right now. in the ducky pic you can even see the pvc pipe through it, and my pipes are grey not white. all i had on hand was pvc conduit. same material and dimension only it's made to be light proof. thats what it says on the side of the pipe anyway i'm no expert on pvc.

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ya know i've had this cheapo ph pen for so many years now and i feel it's reliable. i got that probe kit and calibrated it with the two solutions, it's manual with a screw. and it was off by only 0.4!! i swear the drop solution i got with the GH up/down is what's throwing me off so bad. my dip strips are kinda close, it's hard to tell with those sometimes. and to be honest my strips are from when i worked in the semi conductor mfg stuff like 20 years old now i bet but they seem to be accurate with the pen and calibrating solutions. i have another set of solution test from a master pond tester but it is for a very broad test and only has five colors on it.

you're right i need to just pick the pen i trust and roll with it. it's why i bought a good one, i figured it was more important to know my ph more accurately than my nutrient level at this point. plus i was very surprised with my tds meters when i put in the solution, both were spot on and never needed any calibration. plus there are so many variable that will determine my nutrient needs that the number will probably just be a number for me not others. but PH is ph so i want to know as accurate as i can.

speaking of the tofu torching, i wish Anthem was still around to see this.. he and i discussed me trying a dwc setup and it would be cool for him to see. i know he would have done everything he could to make sure the hydro plants lapped the soil ones, he was competitive thats for sure!!

ya know i've shot up and set fire to plants that pissed me off, how come i never thought of an electronic meter??? great idea man!!!
i never did et to break this bad boy in yet...
View attachment 69153

we got this oldie but goodie..
ya know, when you get that male plant and it really pissed ya off....

Blasting that feller never gets old!
I'm just surprised shooting a soil born plant didn't give @moe.red a boner

Fanciest pH probe I ever had was the kind where it had a digital display box mounted to the wall and wired probes down in the rez for continuous monitoring.
It was a POS.
Later after a few cheapies and spendy options the guy who got me into aquaponics kinda schooled me on them. Biggest thing I took away from those conversations is there was a reason why Hanna only had 3 week warranties on their probes at the time

soil: mixed crab and lobster shell with stonington and watered in with great white, king crab, and green aminos
hydro: put seedlings in washed hydroton. water has floranova grow, orca, king crab, cal/mag - ppm: 256 pH: 5.6

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And they're off!!!
For a minute there I wasn't sure if you were making fuel for a solid rocket engine or garden so now I know, yeah it's a garden.

Weird you dropped some Jane's Addiction too bro. I've had that cranked up in my truck all week!

Back in high school my friends and I would play that song when we drove down off the mountain to head to Berkeley for a punk rock show at Gilman Street Project. Great times getting high, dropping sid, and huffing on whipits

 

[Stoneyluv]

I ran 4:5:10 for a week and then 8:10:20 for a week. Then I hit them with 10:20:20 and right now they're at 25:50:50

yep, thats close enough for me... you got the big block so way more torque.. at five blades emerging i'll turn up the white.

Keep the shiny side up and the greasy side down, steady as she goes.

yes sir!! or as i like to say, keep it between the mayo and the mustard!!

Blasting that feller never gets old!
I'm just surprised shooting a soil born plant didn't give @moe.red a boner

Fanciest pH probe I ever had was the kind where it had a digital display box mounted to the wall and wired probes down in the rez for continuous monitoring.
It was a POS.
Later after a few cheapies and spendy options the guy who got me into aquaponics kinda schooled me on them. Biggest thing I took away from those conversations is there was a reason why Hanna only had 3 week warranties on their probes at the time


And they're off!!!
For a minute there I wasn't sure if you were making fuel for a solid rocket engine or garden so now I know, yeah it's a garden.

Weird you dropped some Jane's Addiction too bro. I've had that cranked up in my truck all week!

Back in high school my friends and I would play that song when we drove down off the mountain to head to Berkeley for a punk rock show at Gilman Street Project. Great times getting high, dropping sid, and huffing on whipits

well if this doesn't pan out maybe i can sell the gear for making biofuel!!!!!!!!

man that's my all time JA favorite right there^^

ahhhhh whipits... i almost forgot those!!! wha wha whaw wha!!!

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got a tap root in the water today!!

 

[Zen_seeker]

Back in high school my friends and I would play that song when we drove down off the mountain to head to Berkeley for a punk rock show at Gilman Street Project. Great times getting high, dropping sid, and huffing on whipits

Lol, read this while eating one of these. Struck me as funny.

 

[Stoneyluv]

View attachment 69391

Lol, read this while eating one of these. Struck me as funny.

you're gonna eat something by a company named Dare?!?! ballsy!!!!!

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hung up some panda film..



and got serious with notes!!!

 

[Stoneyluv]

that old red mylar under the dirty plastic floor in the photo was bothering me... so were the messy cables!!

 

[Stoneyluv]

my first couple days with hydro have gone ok, pH was creeping up faster than expected. second day i lowered the ph with just ph down and ppm's were a little higher EC went from .4 to .6. third day the ph was back up three tenths again. and ppms were much higher. i looked at the charts and both of those charts said to do opposite things when both EC and PH rose so i did none of those and reached out to Aqua Man and he suggested just adding the armour si to buffer the ph.

i mixed it up in a jug this morning and went to work, pH in the rez was oddly still at 5.6 this time. after work i checked my mail and got my new bluelab ph pen, perfect timing!! calibrated it and happily it matched my cheapo i've been using to this point. so i checked the pH again and it was still at 5.6.. held all day, now in the evening and still holding steady at 5.6 and ppm's are right back in line at 252 EC @.4... weird to me. could i have had bad samples for three days, that doesn't make sense but either does it just magically balancing out perfect all of a sudden. it's been spot on for seventeen hours now so i'm not going to add the armour si yet. if it ain't broke don't fix it i guess. the only changes that happened that i can even think of is it got nice and cool last night and before bed i opened up all the basement windows and doors and sucked all kinds of fresh cool air in and it dropped three or four degrees. the rez temp also dropped a degree and a half. sitting at 68.5* right now.

so much to learn yet!!!!

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they're alive though.. still only one root -







who's winning?? soil? h2o?.... tight race on day four!

anyone, thoughts? opinions? concerns? criticism?

 

[GoodShit97]

thoughts? opinions? concerns? criticism? actual fact?

Yeah.
You suck
Jk looks good man.

 

[Stoneyluv]

Yeah.
You suck
Jk looks good man.

see now that would fall under opinion not criticism.. or "actual fact" if you ask my woman!!

 

[GoodShit97]

see now that would fall under opinion not criticism.. or "actual fact" if you ask my woman!!

They're, I fixed it

 

[GrumpAzz]

Looking good bro. It's weird how the res settles but it eventually made sense, so it'll come. It's a good feeling when your res is rock solid. It's what allows me to borderline forget about the plants in the back room. Toddler and work's keeps me short on time. They get a peek through the window and a glance at the meter once a day at best.

-------

Man, Aqua's the damn man.

 

[Stoneyluv]

Looking good bro. It's weird how the res settles but it eventually made sense, so it'll come.

so it's normal for it to move around a bit at first when it's new? ppms went up 100parts the other day and now it's a little lower than it started.

i get that the ph could drift but i didn't expect that much change day to day. i was trying to keep it as close to 5.5 as i could and it was getting up to 5.8 around 24 hrs later.

It's what allows me to borderline forget about the plants in the back room. Toddler and work's keeps me short on time. They get a peek through the window and a glance at the meter once a day at best.

i can see why the live monitor helps. now because it's new i bet i'm down there six times a day! haha

Man, Aqua's the damn man.

yea ya know i didn't even have to ask him.. he reached out to me and offered.

 

[Stoneyluv]

@moe.red , would it be a reliable way to measure my rez using these three sensors with an eps32?

Amazon.com

https://www.amazon.com/Teyleten-Robot-Acquisition-Alkalinity-Monitoring/dp/B09H1MJS4S/ref=sr_1_1?crid=A827JLKPBIZT&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.z2T81W0nO28y0gXqEbFGwIGSsvuuhOMP7J1OBqLRuchRr-U1W0Y_-JQdpAX-XnHOgZPdMLIPsQdzrefkbDxSi0V8zP1PU73K4Pv4SMKcAOKl12dYMqiF212JrIZhIx-d8KP7tQNJ1OXP3txIhqJXrhGmAC0gwe8HM6gz87UGtBXOtE0l2Pc0MuP9gIunsU4YE9eitpaqYs2qVoqfLRKzsgDrY2ZbA8IGz2Mmt3ogkwQ.7e74j5RWzIrkrz7eMiWiv5G5ODVPnqtzMB0wjltyyYM&dib_tag=se&keywords=esp32+ph+sensor&qid=1724207738&sprefix=esp32+ph+%2Caps%2C134&sr=8-1

https://www.amazon.com/CQRobot-Ocean-Compatible-Scientific-Laboratory/dp/B08KXRHK7H/ref=pd_bxgy_d_sccl_1/132-9983686-9618756?pd_rd_w=tto2n&content-id=amzn1.sym.04064661-569a-4d64-8aef-6cc4eefc1253&pf_rd_p=04064661-569a-4d64-8aef-6cc4eefc1253&pf_rd_r=RCK7EXWCTAVQ2HA681JM&pd_rd_wg=f9JUm&pd_rd_r=0014733a-e58b-4765-a0ea-61c9046b453b&pd_rd_i=B08KXRHK7H&psc=1

 

[GrumpAzz]

so it's normal for it to move around a bit at first when it's new? ppms went up 100parts the other day and now it's a little lower than it started.

Yeah there's normally not a ton of drift on the EC but it does happen occasionally. Once it settles it aughta stay put with just seedlings. They won't be able to eat enough yet to affect the EC readings.

i get that the ph could drift but i didn't expect that much change day to day. i was trying to keep it as close to 5.5 as i could and it was getting up to 5.8 around 24 hrs later.

I usually end up with a 5.7 ph when I mix. That usually drifts up and I don't bring it down until I see 6.2. I want to say the initial rise has to do with the Silica breaking down or becoming usable. I'm just spitballing

A natural drift is good and I like to see if it'll settle before I adjust. My range is 5.5 to 6.2

i can see why the live monitor helps. now because it's new i bet i'm down there six times a day! haha

Man it's a blessing for sure, and worth it to me. It'll be worth it for you too if you ever decide on a full on hydro go.

Side note... don't use duct tape to hold up sensitive electronics. I thought I was being slick and taped my monitors to my top-off res. It looked good, but eventually my newest monitor, the one for my top-off res, fell.and jerked out the wire from my ph probe. Now I gotta order a new probe...

yea ya know i didn't even have to ask him.. he reached out to me and offered.

He wants us to succeed and I just think that's awesome. If you can read through his fat-fingered messages, you'll gain a lot from listening to his advice. Hell.. I barely asked any questions on my second grow because he prepared me well enough through my first. Gotta love it.

 

[Aqua Man]

View attachment 69194

Some info is incorrect but oretty good chart.

In flower you may experience a static pH or small pH drop. This can be a concern and can be normal. If all else is good with a small pH drop its simply the difference in nutrient demands. Usually week 3ish. As nutrient demands change the release of h+ ions from the plant can increase resulting in a slow pH drift down. This can be addressed by slightly tweaking nutrients and adding more buffer

 

[moe.red]

@moe.red , would it be a reliable way to measure my rez using these three sensors with an eps32?

Amazon.com

https://www.amazon.com/Teyleten-Robot-Acquisition-Alkalinity-Monitoring/dp/B09H1MJS4S/ref=sr_1_1?crid=A827JLKPBIZT&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.z2T81W0nO28y0gXqEbFGwIGSsvuuhOMP7J1OBqLRuchRr-U1W0Y_-JQdpAX-XnHOgZPdMLIPsQdzrefkbDxSi0V8zP1PU73K4Pv4SMKcAOKl12dYMqiF212JrIZhIx-d8KP7tQNJ1OXP3txIhqJXrhGmAC0gwe8HM6gz87UGtBXOtE0l2Pc0MuP9gIunsU4YE9eitpaqYs2qVoqfLRKzsgDrY2ZbA8IGz2Mmt3ogkwQ.7e74j5RWzIrkrz7eMiWiv5G5ODVPnqtzMB0wjltyyYM&dib_tag=se&keywords=esp32+ph+sensor&qid=1724207738&sprefix=esp32+ph+%2Caps%2C134&sr=8-1

https://www.amazon.com/CQRobot-Ocean-Compatible-Scientific-Laboratory/dp/B08KXRHK7H/ref=pd_bxgy_d_sccl_1/132-9983686-9618756?pd_rd_w=tto2n&content-id=amzn1.sym.04064661-569a-4d64-8aef-6cc4eefc1253&pf_rd_p=04064661-569a-4d64-8aef-6cc4eefc1253&pf_rd_r=RCK7EXWCTAVQ2HA681JM&pd_rd_wg=f9JUm&pd_rd_r=0014733a-e58b-4765-a0ea-61c9046b453b&pd_rd_i=B08KXRHK7H&psc=1

Not sure man I have not used these. I can look a little deeper later.

They will work just don’t know accuracy

 

[moe.red]

Man I like I2C comms the best personally.

This would b a good start for environment

ESP32 Weather Station and Weather Instrument Kit,ESP32 WiFi+BT+BLE Integrated 0.96'' OLED Board DHT-11 Temperature Humidity BMP-180 Atmospheric Pressure BH1750 Light Sensor for Arduino IoT Starter
https://a.co/d/cuxWrRZ

I’ll look up some more gimme a bit. Handling some biz atm

I would not use that ph probe.

The temp probe is not I2C I’d get a probe that uses that and has temp and TDS in one then use the temp readout to compensate the ph reading in software.

At that point you can add any sensors you like at any time. I’ll explain more in a bit.

 

[moe.red]

Stoney scroll down a bit on this page

Gravity: Analog pH Sensor / Meter Pro Kit for Arduino

This industrial pH meter is specifically designed to measure the pH of the solution and reflect the acidity or alkalinity. DFRobot offers industrial ph sensors for Arduino wide inventory, datasheets & technical support.

www.dfrobot.com

Look at the project

You can start small and add what you want when you want like peristaltic pumps o2 co2 rh flow sensors level sensors and and and.

What I like about dfrobot and Adafruit is the software is done and done well. It will be easier than pulling parts from all over. The cheap Chinese shit looks great on the wallet but can drive you crazy. Typically the documentation is bad or just wrong.

 

[Stoneyluv]

I want to say the initial rise has to do with the Silica breaking down or becoming usable. I'm just spitballing

so a little food for thought.. AM says "the ph may rise due to the off gassing of carbonic acid released as co2. So after a day or 2 depending on aeration this may slow down as gasses reach equilibrium.

You can aerate the water before use for 12+ hrs it will remove that from the equation but as long as you are aware of that then no big deal may just need a few more adjustments the first couple days."

remember i wasted all my aerated water in my barrel from leak testing so when i filled my system it was directly from my un-aerated rain tote outside.

so that all kind if makes sense.

.

i'm still having drift issues though, gotta be the way i mixed the stuff or something. i cleaned out a barrel that i can mix everything in before adding it to the system like you do. i'm going to mix up a fresh batch and do a change out. i need to rule out something whatever the issue is.

if nothing else it will make for good practice. a couple bucks to learn but no schooling is free!

He wants us to succeed and I just think that's awesome. If you can read through his fat-fingered messages, you'll gain a lot from listening to his advice. Hell.. I barely asked any questions on my second grow because he prepared me well enough through my first. Gotta love it.

i'm sure he has typed out some of the same things he told you along with a hundred other people but still does it without asking and has the passion to see it work properly. he's been around a long time!!!

Not sure man I have not used these. I can look a little deeper later.

They will work just don’t know accuracy

with those reviews i just wasn't sure at all... you understand what i'm looking for.

Man I like I2C comms the best personally.

This would b a good start for environment

ESP32 Weather Station and Weather Instrument Kit,ESP32 WiFi+BT+BLE Integrated 0.96'' OLED Board DHT-11 Temperature Humidity BMP-180 Atmospheric Pressure BH1750 Light Sensor for Arduino IoT Starter
https://a.co/d/cuxWrRZ

I’ll look up some more gimme a bit. Handling some biz atm

I would not use that ph probe.

The temp probe is not I2C I’d get a probe that uses that and has temp and TDS in one then use the temp readout to compensate the ph reading in software.

At that point you can add any sensors you like at any time. I’ll explain more in a bit.

now your talking!! this is what i was trying to find, something that was comparable to a bluelab monitor.

Stoney scroll down a bit on this page

Gravity: Analog pH Sensor / Meter Pro Kit for Arduino

This industrial pH meter is specifically designed to measure the pH of the solution and reflect the acidity or alkalinity. DFRobot offers industrial ph sensors for Arduino wide inventory, datasheets & technical support.

www.dfrobot.com

Look at the project

You can start small and add what you want when you want like peristaltic pumps o2 co2 rh flow sensors level sensors and and and.

What I like about dfrobot and Adafruit is the software is done and done well. It will be easier than pulling parts from all over. The cheap Chinese shit looks great on the wallet but can drive you crazy. Typically the documentation is bad or just wrong.

you are the fuckin man Moe!!!!! this is exactly what i want and didn't even know it!!!!!!!!! hell yeah this is what i need.

they give ya the parts lists, the codes, the instructions, the hardware lists, drawings... damn!!!!!!!!! this is perfect Moe, my next project for sure!!

so if i don't include the dissolved oxygen or ORP sensor i could make something that will monitor my ph, ec, and water temp with just this stuff for $184?



only thing is i don't see any type of mention of a display or a way to see it live, just that data is stored on sd card.

also seems like there has not been any activity on it since it came out 6 years ago... they even have plug n play kits but the feedback doesn't look the best:

Gravity: KnowFlow Basic Kit - A DIY Water Monitoring Basic Kit

KnowFlow is designed for environmentalists who want to monitor water quality and get real time data.

www.dfrobot.com

 

[Observer]

so it's normal for it to move around a bit at first when it's new? ppms went up 100parts the other day and now it's a little lower than it started.

i get that the ph could drift but i didn't expect that much change day to day. i was trying to keep it as close to 5.5 as i could and it was getting up to 5.8 around 24 hrs later.



i can see why the live monitor helps. now because it's new i bet i'm down there six times a day! haha



yea ya know i didn't even have to ask him.. he reached out to me and offered.

That chart smoke posted is a good starting point

Plants will adjust their own pH too btw

And if you're blowing ambient air into a res, that air includes CO2, which will affect pH.

In part of why bigger systems, more water volume, can be more "stable"

And you'll want you're plants water to drift from 5.4-5.9 or so, to help ensure nutrients availability for all elements.