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Supa Freak, Fryday, and First Lady

Salutations all u beautiful ppl! The ladies r cruising into the finish line soon I hope, maybe another week or two? The fryday has been WAY to close to the lights for awhile now and I believe there is foxtailing going on :|

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My question for u all, should I try to bend the tallest colas or just leave as is? There's like 6-8 of em anywhere from 12" to 3" from the light :| On Monday I did turn the light down to 50% from 60%

Oldest supafreak top bud
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Was having ph problems as well for weeks, I think i got that solved though. Dunno if it was from turning up the air pump or introducing h2O2, but it's no longer dropping .5 in 12 hrs anymore.
Thanks for looking!! Criticism greatly appreciated :)
 
Salutations all u beautiful ppl! The ladies r cruising into the finish line soon I hope, maybe another week or two? The fryday has been WAY to close to the lights for awhile now and I believe there is foxtailing going on :|

View attachment 127811View attachment 127812View attachment 127813

My question for u all, should I try to bend the tallest colas or just leave as is? There's like 6-8 of em anywhere from 12" to 3" from the light :| On Monday I did turn the light down to 50% from 60%

Oldest supafreak top bud
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View attachment 127815

Was having ph problems as well for weeks, I think i got that solved though. Dunno if it was from turning up the air pump or introducing h2O2, but it's no longer dropping .5 in 12 hrs anymore.
Thanks for looking!! Criticism greatly appreciated :)
Hey can you elaborate on adding peroxide? Was that to battle bacteria bloom? The ph dropping can be an indicator of that if it's dropping fast that's almost always the case. If it's a slow drop, usually just time for water change.

I don't remember if you were running live or you run "sterile" (in the hydro sense).

I tried sterile, using peroxide, but ultimately love running live now. But it did require having rodi water as you can almost never trust the water from any other source not to bring something bad eventually.
 
@ninjadip yeah, it was dropping hard for some weeks. I'm guessing it's from what you said. I was using live for most of this grow, king crab. Stopped using it probably around the time of the ph drop, maybe didn't help the ph then? My water source(tap water,) is running through an isprings stage 5 filtration system so it is RO water I'm using. I'll have to look up rodi, is that reverse osmosis distilled or something? I do use calmag for the ro water, than add gh trio. Even after last weeks water change the ph was dropping hard, no king crab added though. Maybe that's been my problem then? Not adding the king crab? But yeah, I'm a week or 2 from axing so maybe from bacteria bloom? I'll have to look that term up lol

Speaking of the almighty 🪓, u r swinging urs around now?! Love this stage of the grow!! lol Excited and watching ur grow, what strain r u doing?
 
DI is just the last container you can add to a RO system that De Ionizes the water.
For my tap it removed the last 20ppm of minerals and such that were left from RO without it.
It is the quickest exhausted and most expensive part of RO/DI systems.
You can simply add one more cartridge to your set up and you will be complete. It is placed last in the filter line.
They sell color changing DI resin so without using a TDS meter you can see when it needs replacement.

When I made RO/DI for my fish the set up was two canisters in series and you would just move the second to the #1 spot when #1 expired and then replace the new media and place it as number 2.
That was to be sure none ever passed as the first canister became exhausted.
Not sure that type of redundancy is needed for the plants.
 
@ninjadip yeah, it was dropping hard for some weeks. I'm guessing it's from what you said. I was using live for most of this grow, king crab. Stopped using it probably around the time of the ph drop, maybe didn't help the ph then? My water source(tap water,) is running through an isprings stage 5 filtration system so it is RO water I'm using. I'll have to look up rodi, is that reverse osmosis distilled or something? I do use calmag for the ro water, than add gh trio. Even after last weeks water change the ph was dropping hard, no king crab added though. Maybe that's been my problem then? Not adding the king crab? But yeah, I'm a week or 2 from axing so maybe from bacteria bloom? I'll have to look that term up lol

Speaking of the almighty 🪓, u r swinging urs around now?! Love this stage of the grow!! lol Excited and watching ur grow, what strain r u doing?
You might not need the DI part, just used to putting it all together, just a little extra. I got my setup from a saltwater fish guy so maybe that part is overkill. Hopefully, i didn't confuse you, RO should be fine.


Did you stop the king crab for a reason? In my experience it's best to add the bennies at every change or water addition. The reason i asked about why peroxide, is because usually if doing live you never add peroxide because that kills the good and bad and usually only used to help fight off a bacteria bloom.

Yeah i just finished chopping today. Double dose from irie genetics. First time growing, buds aren't as big as previous strains I've grown, but looks good and the finish matches the genetic suppliers pictures. Never had one finish this fast, interesting plant.

They took a bunch of blood from me at the doctor today, hopefully they can figure out what is going on with me.

Got a Bush concert next week i don't want to miss lol

Best of luck buddy, i think you got that spark and curiosity with growing that is just awesome.

I would add to this chart if ph is falling fast after a change, it is likely there is a root rot issue from bad bacteria. If your roots look brown, slimy, and smelly that's a very clear indicator you got an issue with bad bacteria, if white and bright you are good to go. This chart helped me understand how to read the patterns between your two readings, EC and pH, likely you've already seen it, but if not here you go
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@ninjadip yeah my ro comes out 0 ppms, have better things to throw money at i think. I really appreciate ur responses though, Nice
Did you stop the king crab for a reason?
Just a newb fuck up, should've kept the crab going. my next grow I imagine, shall be more dialed in. I was a bit too complacent on this grow.
 
Glycerine... among others r sweet songs. Sounds like a good time! My next concert will b motionless in white w bring me the horizon as the headliner in may. stoked for that . I hope u r doing well @ninjadip sounds like u have some health issues:( Will keep watching ur grows to help me expand my knowledge on such.

Yeah, the peroxide was just a hail Mary, i should have not stopped the crab doses, which is probably why my ph started fluctuating. I have no good excuse why I quit using the crab besides stupidity 😒
 
Glycerine... among others r sweet songs. Sounds like a good time! My next concert will b motionless in white w bring me the horizon as the headliner in may. stoked for that . I hope u r doing well @ninjadip sounds like u have some health issues:( Will keep watching ur grows to help me expand my knowledge on such.

Yeah, the peroxide was just a hail Mary, i should have not stopped the crab doses, which is probably why my ph started fluctuating. I have no good excuse why I quit using the crab besides stupidity 😒
Sorry man, i wasn't trying to give you the third degree lol, just asking questions to make sure i understand and don't say shit that doesn't apply.

We've all been there lol


Yeah, health is funny lately. I'd like to think I'm getting better, just very slowly. Thank you for the love, i appreciate it brother.

Speaking of hail Mary, i want to see that movie once i can get a good 4k torrent available
 
Got a Bush concert next week i don't want to miss
Fuck yes 🤘

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With your dropping pH, what's happening to your ppm? Staying steady or is there a rise?

I really like that chart that Ninja shared. It really only works if you're topping off with the same mix as what's in your plant-sites, though. That's the only way to keep everything static unless you're doing add-backs every day like @smoke does. Add-backs were too labor intensive for me. I'm doing hydro so I can go days without having anything to do.

I ask about your PPMs because they can cause the pH to drift, depending on the concentration. Think about your plants.. they'll be drinking no matter what. Ideally, they'll uptake all of what you're giving them. If not, the PPMs will rise as they drink more than they eat. A rise in PPM will cause your pH to drop and vise-versa.

You're towards the end of the run, so they may just be eating less and may have even stopped eating altogether. I'm leaning more towards this, than a bacterial bloom. Does your res smell funny or does it smell like soil or earth, like a good dirt?

The ratios are a more likely culprit if it's happening early on, but can be an issue late in flower as well. Same sort of deal, except they're hungry but can't uptake what they need because the nutrients aren't in the proper ratio. They'll slowly stop uptaking certain salts which, in turn, should show up with a rise in PPMs and a drop in pH.

Failed ratios are not always the grower's fault. Some strains are just hungry for more of something in particular. That's where experience spotting little deficiencies will come in handy.

I had a lot of trouble keeping the GH Trio in line. I think it's an easy one to get out of wack. I used it for 2 grows before switching to Lotus powdered nutes. My plants LOVED that stuff and the resevoir was easy to keep stable, but I hated mixing it. It just didn't seem to fully dissolve. I luckily got a promotional set of bottles from Athena and haven't looked back. Rock solid res for weeks at a time. I've replaced a few bottles in the years since. It's pricey stuff but it's really allowed me the freedom that I wanted out of hydro. I gots kids, man, and I can't be down there dinking with my mixes every day.
 
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, what's happening to your ppm? Staying steady or is there a rise?
My ppms have always been static. I did get overzealous w the nutes about a month ago though, close to 900. Up until then, the ph and ppms stayed the same while the water dropped. I caught something a couple of days ago so I can't smell all that good atm :) Last week? the sites smelled like dirt, pretty weird how that happens lol
The roots themselves r not white, but aren't slimey either. This Saturday I'll do my final change as I'm giving em another week, maybe 2 then chopping. I think I'll skip the nutes minus the calmag and use king crab, otherwise just plain ro. I think I've heard to do this near the end as by now, there's enough nutes in the plant itself and the straight water helps bring out the natural flavor?
 
Last week? the sites smelled like dirt, pretty weird how that happens lol
That's a good smell and a good sign.

The roots themselves r not white, but aren't slimey either.
They can take on a bit of color from the nutes. What are you running? GH Trio? If so, that Micro is the culprit I believe.

This Saturday I'll do my final change as I'm giving em another week, maybe 2 then chopping. I think I'll skip the nutes minus the calmag and use king crab, otherwise just plain ro. I think I've heard to do this near the end as by now, there's enough nutes in the plant itself and the straight water helps bring out the natural flavor?
Flushing is a sensitive subject. I've never given them straight water. I've topped off with RO, slowly diluting the mix, but never gone just RO.
 
That's a good smell and a good sign.


They can take on a bit of color from the nutes. What are you running? GH Trio? If so, that Micro is the culprit I believe.


Flushing is a sensitive subject. I've never given them straight water. I've topped off with RO, slowly diluting the mix, but never gone just RO.
Yeah, that micro is probably why. I'll take ur lead on not flushing. This grow has gotten away from me quite a few times from the start. The strains that did make it weren't really compatible w each other on their growth I believe. The fryday got too tall and the freaks were a little short b4 the flip. Then the one freak was a weak behind the other 2. Not to mention the first lady died cuz of, get this, DEHYDRATION! LOL Had some ph issues, and foxtailing on fryday as well(too close to the light.) Plus I need to get a better handle on a nice even canopy. I should learn to walk before running :) My next grow I think I'll try to grow just 1 strain, be more attentive, and overall, not b dumb lol
 
so my 2¢ is probably only worth about 1 yuan, but...

i also had ph dips with the trio and never figured it out. i even tried buffers and still had issues. i then tried lucas formula and all ph dips and adjustments stopped instantly.

with that being said i do not use RO.. i use filtered tap from my personal deep well. i did not add any buffers or calmag and ph was the steadiest i've ever seen.

if you're interested >> https://hackingthegrow.com/best-hydro-nutrients/
 
so my 2¢ is probably only worth about 1 yuan, but...

i also had ph dips with the trio and never figured it out. i even tried buffers and still had issues. i then tried lucas formula and all ph dips and adjustments stopped instantly.

with that being said i do not use RO.. i use filtered tap from my personal deep well. i did not add any buffers or calmag and ph was the steadiest i've ever seen.

if you're interested >> https://hackingthegrow.com/best-hydro-nutrients/

Thanks for the interesting link! I've heard about this method but have never read up on it b4. So my ph levels and ppms were steady as it could be up until I overfed about a month ago. I didn't do much documentation this grow(2nd) and first time using just trio and calmag. I also quit using bennies around this time as well, stupidly thinking they would still b there in the roots after a water change. That link did say something that the Gro part would add way too much nitrogen, something the micro part had enough of. So, stuff I need to think about for the next grow. I may look into Athena for nutes, but have enough trio to do another grow and I'd hate to just throw it away.
 
Thanks for the interesting link! I've heard about this method but have never read up on it b4. So my ph levels and ppms were steady as it could be up until I overfed about a month ago. I didn't do much documentation this grow(2nd) and first time using just trio and calmag. I also quit using bennies around this time as well, stupidly thinking they would still b there in the roots after a water change. That link did say something that the Gro part would add way too much nitrogen, something the micro part had enough of. So, stuff I need to think about for the next grow. I may look into Athena for nutes, but have enough trio to do another grow and I'd hate to just throw it away.
The gh trio is the easiest thing I've ever used, never had an issue. Never seen root color affected by the micro either. Only time i ever ever get ph dips is if i run for longer than two weeks without a change, or one week during peak flower when uptake is the highest.

One thing that got me was before was the mix process, once I got that, zero issues, easy peasy,i love the trio.

I add silica as the very first addition to RO water. This and the calmag i believe become your pH buffer if done correctly, which i admit i was fucking up for my first handful of grows causing defencies of calcium but not pH drops.

My process:

First, silica, stir vigorously, let sit for at least 20 minutes before next step, it takes time to stabilize and if rushed the mix is botched, imo.

After the 20 minutes then bring the pH down to below 7, some go down to 5.8, but I only get the solution on the acidic side of pH, 7 being neutral and anything lower is considered acidic, which is what you want before next step.

Add calmag, if ph is not lowered first you will have heavy precipitation of chelates i think it's called, basically the solution loses it's bond with the calmag, and is no longer available to plants and ruining the effect of calmag as a second ph buffer, as far as i understand it from one of the oldheads, moe i think.

I wait another 20 minutes after calmag.

Then you can zip through the rest of your supplements without time delay, micro, then either grow/flower next, then the rest of it.

At the end often only a very little amount of pH down is needed to bring from 6.2 to 5.8 pH. Then finally your king crab or other beneficials. Never skip this step.

I follow the ratios from gh recommend charts of lowest aggressive feed. I have my own tailored ratios i follow now based on past grow logs and plant responses. This logging has been my savior, i can look at previous grows to slightly tweek on individual strain needs from current grow.

I don't know if I've been as helpful as i hoped, just trying to help with the lessons I've learned.

I've had root rot before when using tap which causes drastic pH drops, but never with RO water and the water chiller.

Imo gh trio is one of the easiest and widely used nute system in the home grow market, even outside of cannabis, especially with hydro. There is little to zero sediment with the products, which is what i love, and the price point.

Hopefully I've been helpful, I'll get on my computer in a minute to share other info I've used to help guide my ratios outside of mfg charts. Imo the ratios are easy once understood and how the ratio is more important than even total EC, as important as both are, one is even more critical to plant uptake.

Much love and forgive me if this is already known, just always find it helpful to put it all out there.
 
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the base line: ( i sub kelp for floralicious plus, and use TPS Gold for silica instead of armor SI, and don't use anything for the ripen product on this chart. even for me this chart is overly aggresive with end EC. i used to always overfeed thinking that's the answer to bigger plants, often this isn't true. they can be monsters with the right ratios and plenty of new topoff coming in at the right ratios as well. if my EC drops too fast, then i know i have to ramp up the total EC either in my main mix and/or in the topoff.
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the other charts i've used to adjust the above ratios. I have seen great results from using the silica levels in the first chart below to replace the GH numbers in chart above. In the beginning i would also measure the EC at every addition to compare with the below 3 charts to really dial it in. Now i already have that as my repeat baseline, but these charts are invaluable. I forget the source, but was shared with me from oldheads on here i believe.
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please note that this last grow i was off by two weeks with my flower regiment, all flower ratios should be shifted 2 weeks earlier from what i have in this last chart. i was waiting for bud sites to develop before ramping up nutes, something new i tried, but i delayed too long i believe ultimately ending in smaller buds from previous grows, lesson learned i won't be doing again. but you get the gist, any blanks are when i didn't use that product. it's far from perfect, but this really helps me to keep track and make slight adjustments to previous week based on growth cycle and uptake speed without having to reinvent the wheel each week. the columns are in exact order of how i add product, the numbers are the exact ml i add for my system of roughly 7 gallons. i've learned this go around that the top off needs to be at least 150% of the main mix strength to maintain EC in the system. for topoff mix i never use any organics like kelp or fulvic as it isn't a moving system or chilled, just air stones, just something i do to minimize any sediment buildup or other bad things in the top off res.

this grow i kept a flat ratio of the trio during the grow stage, in previous grows i have slightly higher nitrogen ratios, but found a flat ratio works just as fine. the flower ratios are much more important to me. (the accidental blanks for hydro guard with changes is an omission on the chart, not an actual physical ommision, something i just saw now, i always add it, but sometimes i forget to log it)

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fulvic* this one is a bit of a debate for me. mfg recommends much more product in the early stages and less later, but i have not found that to be beneficial to my grows. i like a very clean solution in early stages and find that more fulvic really helps when EC is high. the highlighted part in green matches exactly what i have seen first hand. I use mr. fulvic brand. The improved nutrient availability is another huge help in RDWC systems, really this product is a miracle worker i stand behind 100%. It really helps to keep uptake high even if ratios are not perfect.

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ii've shared all my secrets now lol. the secret to the laziest hydro grower here most likely. i simply repeat and adjust slightly if needed and never worry about much. Action: "Check" is simply me logging current EC and ph levels, in previous grows i logged much more data, naturally over time i log less as it becomes second nature to when to change, and what to adjust on the next mix based on growth cycle and plant observations.

maybe it's just me on this site, but i love the trio, and find it very easy to dial in. works amazing in a RDWC setup as everything is very water soluble, something that minimizes sediment in a RDWC setup.in the beginning i used single site DWC buckets and used the GH Nova line (2 part instead of 3 part) but this product is not good for RDWC as it has heavy sediment from organics.

this is only my 3rd grow since logging data, but it has been very VERY helpful for me. it might seem complex, but trust me it's very simple in the grand scheme of things and gives you great control on ratios. the learning curve is worth it, imo. slightly harder than an A/B (2 part mix) but only by one degree while offering the grower a tighter control of ratios.
 
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Fuck yes 🤘

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With your dropping pH, what's happening to your ppm? Staying steady or is there a rise?

I really like that chart that Ninja shared. It really only works if you're topping off with the same mix as what's in your plant-sites, though. That's the only way to keep everything static unless you're doing add-backs every day like @smoke does. Add-backs were too labor intensive for me. I'm doing hydro so I can go days without having anything to do.

I ask about your PPMs because they can cause the pH to drift, depending on the concentration. Think about your plants.. they'll be drinking no matter what. Ideally, they'll uptake all of what you're giving them. If not, the PPMs will rise as they drink more than they eat. A rise in PPM will cause your pH to drop and vise-versa.

You're towards the end of the run, so they may just be eating less and may have even stopped eating altogether. I'm leaning more towards this, than a bacterial bloom. Does your res smell funny or does it smell like soil or earth, like a good dirt?

The ratios are a more likely culprit if it's happening early on, but can be an issue late in flower as well. Same sort of deal, except they're hungry but can't uptake what they need because the nutrients aren't in the proper ratio. They'll slowly stop uptaking certain salts which, in turn, should show up with a rise in PPMs and a drop in pH.

Failed ratios are not always the grower's fault. Some strains are just hungry for more of something in particular. That's where experience spotting little deficiencies will come in handy.

I had a lot of trouble keeping the GH Trio in line. I think it's an easy one to get out of wack. I used it for 2 grows before switching to Lotus powdered nutes. My plants LOVED that stuff and the resevoir was easy to keep stable, but I hated mixing it. It just didn't seem to fully dissolve. I luckily got a promotional set of bottles from Athena and haven't looked back. Rock solid res for weeks at a time. I've replaced a few bottles in the years since. It's pricey stuff but it's really allowed me the freedom that I wanted out of hydro. I gots kids, man, and I can't be down there dinking with my mixes every day.
I'm in an Autopot system with GH nutes in my res. I don't have any issues as long as I add the nutes in the proper order. With Cal/mag /Micro/Grow/Bloom/Diamond Nectar. I don't use Cal/mag until weeks 2-3 in flower( my well water has enough through veg) and I need to dump my res before adding a mix with Cal/mag in it or I get separation and particles in my water.

I've played with different percentages over the years but I'm back to pretty close to the bottles recommendations / feed schedule. I don't give an RA about PH or PPM any longer I don't bother checking as long as plants are happy. The bottles have all the info I need to keep my plants thriving

I'm a firm believer in using only one company for all your plants nutrient needs, their products are designed to work together. I'm not sure if you are using more than 1 but its my spiel for keeping a res clean
 
Idk if one brand has anything to do with a clean res. I have a very very clean res at all times, zero salt build up, zero precipitation. Yes, it's not something to take lightly, but if research is done and the chemical differences understood across brands there is definitely no issue using different brands, especially with supplements like silica or fulvic acid. They are what they are, very straight forward products, imo.

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Sometimes a mix can offer better stability than using all of the same brand, at least that's what I've seen first hand. Getting the best from various sources is always my goal.
 

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I'm not saying you can't mix and match but doing so there's a good chance of missing micro nutrients the plants need that get covered by the well paid scientist that design the products for their companies. And or interaction issues with essential nutes precipitating out do to an improper mixing of 2 differently designed products. I don't think that mixing General Hydroponics stuff with Advanced nutrients will blend the same way. I haven't really looked at their Grow/micro/bloom products but I don't think both General and Advanced have the exact same formula, as an example.
 
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