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SSHZ does Ethos "Zsweet Inzanity".........again

Pita when I have to move a plant out through the door to get to the others..hate doing it..

looking good sshz..they look light.
 
Pic’s up of everything in their new surroundings after they acclimate themselves.

Max, like you, I had to pull everything out, placing the tall to one side and the short to the other. It’s the only way I can compare them to each other. It wasn’t as bad as a defoliation, and when done, I adjusted the lights to a more even and level photon distribution. It will pay off in the long run I’m sure.

Today is day 17.
 
i have about a ft the difference in heights lol.I’ve got 7 clones I’ve taken for nxt grow..i betcha these stay short and get them stacking..I willpic one and make some seeds…this will b my first run with clones..you still thinking of getting the truffle clone.
 
i gave it a lot of thought......it will be available for a few months. difference is, clones do not yield the same. they don't have the established root system to grow a large plant unless you grow them a very long time and their structure can be a bit crazy when grown out. i may get seeds at some point, but they are pricey too to do a whole room full.
 
SSHZ said:
i gave it a lot of thought......it will be available for a few months. difference is, clones do not yield the same. they don't have the established root system to grow a large plant unless you grow them a very long time and their structure can be a bit crazy when grown out. i may get seeds at some point, but they are pricey too to do a whole room full.
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Can you back this up with any science? Not doubting you but if it's true it has ramifications for those growing larger plants.
 
Max- i may buy a few of them and send them to you to work with........we just need them to get thru.
 
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  • Agree
Reactions: Max
Roots.....science, no, not really. But it's out there somewhere as i've seen numerous breeders discuss it. But 35+ years of growing both have shown me the light.

Clones do not have the root system to support a large plant, as they do not have a main tap root like a plant from seed. You can get them to grow big, but it will be a long time in veg. With seeds, 100-110 days you get a large plant and large yield.

Further, I think clones grow roots closer to the surface. The tap root off a seed grows down deep, straight down.

Anyone else want to comment on this, help a brother out. lol
 
SSHZ said:
Roots.....science, no, not really. But it's out there somewhere as i've seen numerous breeders discuss it. But 35+ years of growing both have shown me the light.

Clones do not have the root system to support a large plant, as they do not have a main tap root like a plant from seed. You can get them to grow big, but it will be a long time in veg. With seeds, 100-110 days you get a large plant and large yield.

Further, I think clones grow roots closer to the surface. The tap root off a seed grows down deep, straight down.

Anyone else want to comment on this, help a brother out. lol
Click to expand...
I've also read similar, but don't have any direct experience outdoors where I imagine this would really come into play. indoors, and depending on the method of grow, i've managed to get some very respectably sized plants that started out as clones within reasonable veg times.
 
it depends what you count as reasonable..........you will NOT have the same size plant growing from seed vs. clone, in the same time frame.
 
SSHZ said:
it depends what you count as reasonable..........you will NOT have the same size plant growing from seed vs. clone, in the same time frame.
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some day i'll do a side by side and put that to the test. i've always found the few weeks of lag time when starting from seed to be fairly prohibitive whereas i can get clones rooted in as little as seven days and right into veg. then again there's also the issue of genetics and vitality of the seed. some seeds are more vigorous than others, but with a carefully chosen cultivar and a strong healthy mom, the clones are almost guaranteed to be just as vigorous as the mother stock.

never ran seed plants side by side with clones, so my perceptions of growth rates are probably wrong. would be an interesting side-by-side for sure!
 
SSHZ said:
Roots.....science, no, not really. But it's out there somewhere as i've seen numerous breeders discuss it. But 35+ years of growing both have shown me the light.

Clones do not have the root system to support a large plant, as they do not have a main tap root like a plant from seed. You can get them to grow big, but it will be a long time in veg. With seeds, 100-110 days you get a large plant and large yield.

Further, I think clones grow roots closer to the surface. The tap root off a seed grows down deep, straight down.

Anyone else want to comment on this, help a brother out. lol
Click to expand...
SSHZ I have noticed some pretty big differences in growth of clones versus from seeds. I have been running clones for so long I did really notice it until I stated looking for some new cultivars. First off seeds can take a ton of light pretty much from day one. I know you run your lights at full capacity from day one. A clone IMO just cannot handle that kind of light, maybe 20 percent once rooted. I believe it takes a clone much longer to develop the root system required for high PPFD. I find myself not able to get a clone to accept 100 percent of the light from the same light you are running until the clone is about 40 days old. I try to have the lights at 100 percent no later than the end of week 1 of flower. Once the clones are able to handle ( the root system) the light they really take off. I ran soil before and I further believe clones in soil can handle more light quicker than in hydro.
 
There you go.........from the man himself.

i look at it this way- the tap root from seed i'd guess is the best at absorbing moisture in the medium. And the longer the tap root, the more smaller roots it's able to out out. Since clones do not have one, they are lacking in roots and their ability to absorb enough to handle a high respiration rate under 100% lighting. i think the tap root also goes a long way to support the overall plant and helps large plants stay upright.

When i grew from clones, i always had a single mother, which was a clone at one time. i've had a single mother give me over 1000 clones in her life. when she became too root bound, i'd turn one of her clones into a new mother. The clones took months to develop into a large size. i thought the key advantage of clones was they take on the mothers age. So a clone from a mother 1 year old is already one year old, and will flower earlier than a plant from seed. But then the consideration is having it large enough before flowering, so the yield is what you are looking for.
 
SSHZ said:
There you go.........from the man himself.

i look at it this way- the tap root from seed i'd guess is the best at absorbing moisture in the medium. And the longer the tap root, the more smaller roots it's able to out out. Since clones do not have one, they are lacking in roots and their ability to absorb enough to handle a high respiration rate under 100% lighting. i think the tap root also goes a long way to support the overall plant and helps large plants stay upright.

When i grew from clones, i always had a single mother, which was a clone at one time. i've had a single mother give me over 1000 clones in her life. when she became too root bound, i'd turn one of her clones into a new mother. The clones took months to develop into a large size. i thought the key advantage of clones was they take on the mothers age. So a clone from a mother 1 year old is already one year old, and will flower earlier than a plant from seed. But then the consideration is having it large enough before flowering, so the yield is what you are looking for.
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Interesting take. Would leave to see how the biology works on this.
 
A simple google search and you'll find plenty of info......just look for plants, not trees. Per a college course:

"Normally plants which have a taproots have a bigger size plant size such as almost all the tree plants as well as vegetable crops, that means those plants require more water and nutrients, so taproots suppose to be more active to absorb both water and nutrients."

i took 8 credits of advanced biology in college- i was premed in college. So, tap root= good. No tap root= bad.

LOL Lol
 
I speak purely from a commercial point of view.......... it was not a knock on his plants mind you. When I see space in a grow room that you can drive a car thru, I see dollar bills flying out the window. It’s just my approach. No disrespect intended..........
 
SSHZ said:
I speak purely from a commercial point of view.......... it was not a knock on his plants mind you. When I see space in a grow room that you can drive a car thru, I see dollar bills flying out the window. It’s just my approach. No disrespect intended..........
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Wasn't taken that way at all, was just out in the garage me and a bowl of hash, thinking "i like my rooms, that's why they call them "rooms
 
SSHZ said:
When I see space in a grow room that you can drive a car thru, I see dollar bills flying out the window.
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Hey 👋🏻 20230905_203041.jpg
Gotta have room for equipment too 🤣

Usually i run 4 but the rh was pushing 60 at 4 plants even with the dehu in there.
The empty space in my tent kills me man.
 
SSHZ said:
I speak purely from a commercial point of view.......... it was not a knock on his plants mind you. When I see space in a grow room that you can drive a car thru, I see dollar bills flying out the window. It’s just my approach. No disrespect intended..........
Click to expand...
I know the feeling. Whenever I pass by a vacant warehouse my first thought is "I wonder how much power they got in there?"
 
I’ve done only
SSHZ said:
Roots.....science, no, not really. But it's out there somewhere as i've seen numerous breeders discuss it. But 35+ years of growing both have shown me the light.

Clones do not have the root system to support a large plant, as they do not have a main tap root like a plant from seed. You can get them to grow big, but it will be a long time in veg. With seeds, 100-110 days you get a large plant and large yield.

Further, I think clones grow roots closer to the surface. The tap root off a seed grows down deep, straight down.

Anyone else want to comment on this, help a brother out. lol
Click to expand...
one clone I had taken early in flower I’d done in previous grows took ages to reveg and had a heap of branches when it was only 7’’ tall . cut the ones I didn’t want and bent 8 out away from ea other.stayed very short and took up fuckall room but harvested between 4-5 ounces.I thought to myself straight away if I could monstercrop all the time I reckon I could get way more plants in my room like you do sshz. but they take friggen ages lol .I only have 2-3 monster cropped ,the other taken before flower..was going to show ya a pic of the one I done a yr or so ago but my threads have been banished from the big sook farm..
 
I've been running 750-800ppm to try and green them up some but am giving them 50/50 grow/bloom mix now thru week 6. All told, it's been an easy grow with no real difficulties other than the continuous leaf growth. I've been fertilizing with every watering, about every day and a half. At some point though, i'll go on a flush regiment every 3rd watering but i won't start that until i see some leaf burn on the leaf tips, which hasn't happened as of yet. Reverse osmosis water only, always at 6.3 pH.

I haven't seen anymore gnats of late, that issue has been resolved i'm guessing too.
 
You guys will like this.....lol

Here's my Zsweet Inzanity grow from 2018, under 2 HPS in a different room. i didn't top, and i didn't defoliate or lolipop. This is at 3 weeks, 2 days further along than my current grow. Notice any differences? lol

IMG_0823 (1).JPG
 
The difference is night and day.........i used to bitch about how short the plants stayed when i first started using led's, but once i saw i could still get monster yields with shorties, it became way easier to manage the grow and i never looked back.
 
3 weeks done flowering today (Saturday), some pics up in the afternoon......
 
SSHZ said:
Roots.....science, no, not really. But it's out there somewhere as i've seen numerous breeders discuss it. But 35+ years of growing both have shown me the light.

Clones do not have the root system to support a large plant, as they do not have a main tap root like a plant from seed. You can get them to grow big, but it will be a long time in veg. With seeds, 100-110 days you get a large plant and large yield.

Further, I think clones grow roots closer to the surface. The tap root off a seed grows down deep, straight down.

Anyone else want to comment on this, help a brother out. lol
Click to expand...
I have never ran clones side by side either but I understand when the tap root hits the bottom of a container it will trigger flower stage. My 2 cents SSgrower
 
W
SSHZ said:
I speak purely from a commercial point of view.......... it was not a knock on his plants mind you. When I see space in a grow room that you can drive a car thru, I see dollar bills flying out the window. It’s just my approach. No disrespect intended..........
Click to expand...
Sometimes when growing perpetual fir my own use variety is the goal not quantity I’ve pulled as little as a 1/2 lb out a 5x5 before ! - on the flip side nice work sshz you got ur grows dialed been running like that for a minute or two I would assume ! Lol
Nice work
 
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