Stoney's Candylicious Hydro scrog

[Stoneyluv]

Those pics look better than yesterday. Must have been lighting.

This is what I was seeing that I no longer do on today's pics

View attachment 78992

ahh yeah that might have been the lighting, now that i think about it in the first pic i had the grow light on 1% white light and the second pic i took lights out.

i'll look at it again today just to make sure nothing is pale green/yellow like that.

to be honest i was a little concerned with the red in the veins.. isn't this a sign of too much K? and my concern after now adding all the potassium..

 

[moe.red]

ahh yeah that might have been the lighting, now that i think about it in the first pic i had the grow light on 1% white light and the second pic i took lights out.

i'll look at it again today just to make sure nothing is pale green/yellow like that.

to be honest i was a little concerned with the red in the veins.. isn't this a sign of too much K? and my concern after now adding all the potassium..

View attachment 79012

Yes keep an eye on K levels for sure, too much will burn veg babies fast.

That seedling looks healthy to me in that pic. I would not sweat the purple in the petiole. That's as likely or more likely to be genetics than K overdose IMO. Lets see how she grows out the next couple of days.

UV can also bring out red petioles on plants that would otherwise not display them. UVA especially from what I have seen. I got pics somewhere where a petiole under UVA was red everywhere except where the petiole was shaded by a leaf above it. Did not impact growth that I could tell.

 

[Stoneyluv]

midway through week two and the growth seems to be steady, same with the pH... steady eddy!!!

lights still the same power... about 200 μmol/s heavy blue/half white/little red

 

[Stoneyluv]

cruzing right into week three since seed and plants are growing. bumped up the white spectrum and now officially in veg stage!!



i know Moe told me not to worry about the shorter plant being lower in the netcup. and i tried, i really did but it was bugging me so i gave her a tug a few days ago.




both plants have little weird spots on their leaves and some of the veins are even mutated a little, nothing that has me worried at this point but just something i noticed. for now i'll call em birthmarks.

pH is 5.8
ppm's are about 260-270 (it seems to bounce back and forth every two days???) maybe just riding at 269 and tips the scale some days. IDK
water temp-71° air temp-78° leaf temp-74° rh-65% vpd 0.7

thinking about bumping the light power up and maybe doing a change out to bring up the EC a couple points. they're still pups yet so maybe i'll just stay the coarse for now. IDK

roots are looking great on both plants, better than they did my first round, these are tougher and pure white compared to my first attempt. speaking of the first attempt the buds are pretty much dry and ready for trimming... i'll smoke some with some friends this weekend and see what they say!! smells awesome though, glad i did the proxide wash!!!

another positive note is the weather stripping i put on is working very well, not a single drip comes out of the lids. been bone dry!



keep on keepin on.. life's a garden, dig it!

 

[moe.red]

How those roots doing? Should have about the same structure below as above or even more root than plant hopefully. The faster the roots grow now proportional to green the better the scrog will fill out later. A lot of that is genetics but you can steer it too.

 

[Stoneyluv]

How those roots doing? Should have about the same structure below as above or even more root than plant hopefully. The faster the roots grow now proportional to green the better the scrog will fill out later. A lot of that is genetics but you can steer it too.

Not great Moe, they're single rooted diving deep just like you said they would.



i was thinking of maybe taking the elbows off of the waterfalls and et the water hit the side of the netcup and then rotate it once in a while, do you think this would do anything at all or am i fucked until next time when i start over?

https://imgur.com/a/czYsocJ

 

[GrumpAzz]

i was thinking of maybe taking the elbows off of the waterfalls and et the water hit the side of the netcup and then rotate it once in a while, do you think this would do anything at all or am i fucked until next time when i start over?

I don't think you want the media soaked. Are you thinking it'll hit the root and imitate some sort of resistance?

 

[Stoneyluv]

I don't think you want the media soaked. Are you thinking it'll hit the root and imitate some sort of resistance?

well my thought was that roots like to grow towards the source so i thought if i made the source come from the side the roots would grow that direction... i know it's even sillier as i just typed it out loud.

would if i "trimmed the dead ends" from the roots, do you think that could promote side growth?

what if i blow real hard down the center of the stem?

i'm not so sure there is anything i can do except live and learn. and laugh!

 

[Observer]

would if i "trimmed the dead ends" from the roots, do you think that could promote side growth?

Possibly

If the ""environment"" allows

 

[moe.red]

You will be fine not fucked. Plants be planting.



The one on the left produces a tall skinny plant in the wild. The one on the right more bushy.

For scrog you want your kushy to be bushy.

None of this is life or death and you still have control with cropping and tucking. It just makes it harder to scrog with an evergreen than a maple kinda thing.

I have not played with trimming roots enough to offer advice. In theory it should work. My advice is don’t do it on this grow.

I don’t put 90s on my waterfalls. The splashing is enough to keep the netpots moist. If there is no water in the media it’s basically a dead zone for microbes and roots. Think air pruning in the netpot as the extreme

In a perfect world top layer of media is dry but below is moist. Helps to prevent things like algae and crown rot while keeping the root zone happy.

 

[Stoneyluv]

Thanks Moe, this all makes sense i get what you're saying!

I don’t put 90s on my waterfalls. The splashing is enough to keep the netpots moist. If there is no water in the media it’s basically a dead zone for microbes and roots. Think air pruning in the netpot as the extreme

In a perfect world top layer of media is dry but below is moist. Helps to prevent things like algae and crown rot while keeping the root zone happy.

got ya.. not sure why i didn't think of it this way before.. i can improve on this part of it for sure. i'm learning that dialing in the nutes is only half of it, dialing in the system is just as important.

 

[moe.red]

Thanks Moe, this all makes sense i get what you're saying!



got ya.. not sure why i didn't think of it this way before.. i can improve on this part of it for sure. i'm learning that dialing in the nutes is only half of it, dialing in the system is just as important.

Dialing it in is what I am talking about. You have a good grow going either way, don't sweat it. But I know you like to dive a little deeper, and the things I am mentioning might help you get to peak plant.

I'll let you know if I ever get there

Root structure and morphology is not something you get to play with much in soil. Clearly it is not needed for a successful grow. But with hydro and having direct access to the roots, why not?

You also have spectrum control, which is another huge tweak zone for us.

BTW - I don;t see the spots on the plants you mentioned. You might be picking fly shit outta pepper on that

 

[Stoneyluv]

I'll let you know if I ever get there

trying new things out is all the fun!!!!

BTW - I don;t see the spots on the plants you mentioned. You might be picking fly shit outta pepper on that

just weird scars, and some of the veins don't align with each other...

 

[moe.red]

Ahh OK.

If it is still throwing these after a few nodes we can take a closer look. Probably genetics and the fact it is still a toddler and will grow out of it. I don't see this as something you are doing but let's watch it.

 

[Stoneyluv]

Ahh OK.

If it is still throwing these after a few nodes we can take a closer look. Probably genetics and the fact it is still a toddler and will grow out of it. I don't see this as something you are doing but let's watch it.

Thanks Moe, if it's not something from me then it might be genetic. both plants have it, the other one is more subtle...

 

[Stoneyluv]

I don’t put 90s on my waterfalls. The splashing is enough to keep the netpots moist. If there is no water in the media it’s basically a dead zone for microbes and roots. Think air pruning in the netpot as the extreme

In a perfect world top layer of media is dry but below is moist. Helps to prevent things like algae and crown rot while keeping the root zone happy

i drew up a drip ring to try out, the water comes from the center of the posts trying to keep the top layers dry and wet the rest.



have you tried something like this before?

 

[moe.red]

i drew up a drip ring to try out, the water comes from the center of the posts trying to keep the top layers dry and wet the rest.

View attachment 80276

have you tried something like this before?

Yup yup.

 

[Stoneyluv]

a little side boob action!!!!!

 

[Stoneyluv]

a few days ago i think i found my potassium limits. i've been having an issue with the ph sinking and kept adding KOH on top of what i already had in there i think it was just too much, so i raised the light and did a change out and they seem to be a little better but still not thriving well. i think i want to try a different solution ratio and maybe more N.. right now i'm using about 250ppm of 7-4-10 novagrow and about 60ppm of K buffer and a little floralicious, not much maybe 15ppm of 2-.8-.5

i'm almost out of top off solution, in fact it would all fit in there now without overfilling it so i wanna try something different. what i have ain't jiving!! i'd like to use less buffer and see if i can't get the pH to climb a little. i have a much better handle on that then i did the first go around so i wanna see how much trouble i can get myself into!!! hehe

here are photos to compare a few days ago compared to just now.. old shots first...




and now today.... (left side - left plant.. right - right!!)








for now i gave them both a good spritz of foop foliar... its my go to lockout fixer...

 

[Stoneyluv]

i learned something important about my rain water. when the water is around the 35° mark it really throws off the ppm meter. it was frustrating me last night and i really thought something was in my water. i thought maybe because we didn't have rain for over forty days and that made it dirty when it did rain.. nope, all just the temperature.

of coarse i learned this after i dumped out 25 gallons of perfectly clean cold rain water!!! hahaha

moving forward with a change out.. i went with just 30% of the potassium that i started with last time. before calmag i am at 20ppm. i am going to double the veg nutes from what i had. and will aim for ph 5.8 to match what they're currently at.

 

[Bandit420]

a few days ago i think i found my potassium limits. i've been having an issue with the ph sinking and kept adding KOH on top of what i already had in there i think it was just too much, so i raised the light and did a change out and they seem to be a little better but still not thriving well. i think i want to try a different solution ratio and maybe more N.. right now i'm using about 250ppm of 7-4-10 novagrow and about 60ppm of K buffer and a little floralicious, not much maybe 15ppm of 2-.8-.5

i'm almost out of top off solution, in fact it would all fit in there now without overfilling it so i wanna try something different. what i have ain't jiving!! i'd like to use less buffer and see if i can't get the pH to climb a little. i have a much better handle on that then i did the first go around so i wanna see how much trouble i can get myself into!!! hehe

here are photos to compare a few days ago compared to just now.. old shots first...

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and now today.... (left side - left plant.. right - right!!)

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View attachment 81141View attachment 81143
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for now i gave them both a good spritz of foop foliar... its my go to lockout fixer...

View attachment 81150

You seem to be liking the Foop stuff.
I saw it was a black friday deal for the whole kit and had it in my cart but it dropped due to going past m,y set spending limit.
I['d really like to give a whole grow chance and see what happens. I really like their pH adjusters.

i learned something important about my rain water. when the water is around the 35° mark it really throws off the ppm meter. it was frustrating me last night and i really thought something was in my water. i thought maybe because we didn't have rain for over forty days and that made it dirty when it did rain.. nope, all just the temperature.

of coarse i learned this after i dumped out 25 gallons of perfectly clean cold rain water!!! hahaha

moving forward with a change out.. i went with just 30% of the potassium that i started with last time. before calmag i am at 20ppm. i am going to double the veg nutes from what i had. and will aim for ph 5.8 to match what they're currently at.

What meter you have?
Mine is Blue Labs truncheon and it's temp range 32*-120* but yeah those lower temps can cause a +-.1EC/+-70ppm inaccurate reading on mine. Now instead of the tank storage outdoors and I have the second tank indoors to keep it around room temp

 

[moe.red]

i learned something important about my rain water. when the water is around the 35° mark it really throws off the ppm meter. it was frustrating me last night and i really thought something was in my water. i thought maybe because we didn't have rain for over forty days and that made it dirty when it did rain.. nope, all just the temperature.

of coarse i learned this after i dumped out 25 gallons of perfectly clean cold rain water!!! hahaha

moving forward with a change out.. i went with just 30% of the potassium that i started with last time. before calmag i am at 20ppm. i am going to double the veg nutes from what i had. and will aim for ph 5.8 to match what they're currently at.

EC probes need to be temp compensated.

I’ll show you what I mean when I head back down.

 

[Stoneyluv]

ou seem to be liking the Foop stuff.
I saw it was a black friday deal for the whole kit and had it in my cart but it dropped due to going past m,y set spending limit.
I['d really like to give a whole grow chance and see what happens. I really like their pH adjusters.

man i am a big fan of that foliar spray from foop... i call it my foop oops fixer!!! whenever i have a weird lockout or def. on a youngin it's my go to. as soon as they have five blades i give them one spritz a day. once they are bigger they can take a few pumps.

it's a game changer product for me. prime sales always have the gallons at a decent price. it's stinky though man!! at first you;re like mmm mint.. yea, then the poopy lingers just after.. hahaha!!!!

What meter you have?
Mine is Blue Labs truncheon and it's temp range 32*-120* but yeah those lower temps can cause a +-.1EC/+-70ppm inaccurate reading on mine. Now instead of the tank storage outdoors and I have the second tank indoors to keep it around room temp

i use blue labs as well. i actually got the EC meter for free on ebay. and bought the ph meter open box for a great deal!

EC probes need to be temp compensated.

I’ll show you what I mean when I head back down.

i just assumed that since it could read the temp that it had an algorithm in it to automatically adjust.. it was crazy the number was 380-450 when i first put it in the barrel, i was like wtf?! i measured right from the hose tap and still high AF... i gave up after dumping a bunch out and cleaning my mixing barrel and trying to filter and few other crazy efforts that kept kicking my ass... i gave up and just went to bed.. next day after the water warmed up to room temp it measured 9 PPM!!!!!!

i lived it... i learned it!!!!

 

[Stoneyluv]

so just after four weeks now i believe we're not much further.. i still have spider mites in this cabinet!! i tool advantage of Mi benificials sales and bought some miles to fight them but it's been three days now and still see a few so i don't think many of the miles were alive and froze to death out at my mailbox that day.

the burning of the leaves stopped once i did the changeout without all the potassium so i'm pretty sure that was it..



i'm still not likeing the new solution either.. ph keeps diving down everyday causing swings and causing stress. i've been keeping them on an IV by daily foliar feeds.





and thats where i'm at... not the worst but certainty not OK.. i'm persistent though and am trying not to react and think about what i do before i just knee jerk it like normal!!!

 

[Stoneyluv]

plants are now six weeks old and still alive.. trying to end the mites and haven't seen any signs since my last update but i've said this before so i'm hopeful!!

still dealing with ph drops all my charts tell me to lower the EC so i've been slowly doing this but doesn't seem to make a difference. i've added close to 30ml of K now in this batch so i gotta be careful how much more up i add but i also can't keep finding my rez at 4.7 either. i added about another 10-15 ml tonight. i'll see where it's at in a couple hours.

 

[GrumpAzz]

You're using Potassium Silicate, right? Agsil even? I feel like with the way the plant uses the silicate, it loses it's ability to act as a buffer. I could be wrong, on that. Have the drops been happening since the last res change? Or did they start happening a while afterwards?

I've also heard that airstones lower the ph with carbonic acid or something like that.

 

[Stoneyluv]

ou're using Potassium Silicate, right? Agsil even?

yes sir, actually i've been using all four of the kinds i have combined. agsil, koh, gh ph up, and armor si.

that fist solution i overdid it trying to bring it up after what Moe said about using the bennies. then when i did the change out after i burned them i cut the total K in half

Have the drops been happening since the last res change?

the other change i made was increasing the veg nutes and this is when the ph diving started.. hind sight i should have noticed this then! so then i did that second changeout and felt i was falling further behind so i up'd the veg nutes even more... i gotta stop thinking i can force feed plants dammit!!!!

so when i raised the EC even more out of whack the problem got even worse... so a little bit ago i pumped half the rez out into the mixing barrel and topped off the rez with plain water and didn't need to adjust the ph. i cut the EC in half.. it's now at 0.7 and ph is 5.8

i'll check it again tomorrow...

I've also heard that airstones lower the ph with carbonic acid or something like that.

i lowered both buckets air just in case.

 

[steamroller]

My understanding of air and water is that air bubbles raise pH only by removing excess CO2 and bringing the water to equilibrium.
There is a limit to how much this works and effects pH.

 

[GrumpAzz]

My understanding of air and water is that air bubbles raise pH only by removing excess CO2 and bringing the water to equilibrium.
There is a limit to how much this works and effects pH.

Yep you're right. I'm not sure what I was thinking.

Carbonic Acid??
I musta been high...

 

[steamroller]

I musta been high...

That covers most of my life from 6th grade~!