Cult Classic Mellow Fellow in RDWC - Bud Builders

At 206 have you noticed the ppm falling (eating) ?
Only been at 206 since last night and so far, no, the ppm is remaining static, she is drinking albeit slowly because she is so small. So far today, ppms remained constant but pH started to drop a bit again so diluted with one more gallon of plain RO got it down to 197 and it's pretty steady there.

I noticed the further out the ppm was on the high side, the quicker and more abrupt the pH changes were. Once I started getting close to where she wanted to be, things mellowed out a lot and now just doing fine adjustments to get in that sweet spot.
Interesting when you lower the ppms by 100 ppm it stabilizes the PH.
This is very interesting indeed. There is a 3 way going on here between ppm, pH and the plant itself. Once I studied that EC/PH Imbalance chart and started applying it, I started to see how they all interact with each other and my job is to find that sweet spot and then adapt as the needs of the plants change both in the early stages and in the late. I've noticed ppm changes as small as 30 will get you in and out of that sweet spot and so I make gradual moves in the direction I want to go based on the chart ad what the water is telling me.
 
Only been at 206 since last night and so far, no, the ppm is remaining static, she is drinking albeit slowly because she is so small. So far today, ppms remained constant but pH started to drop a bit again so diluted with one more gallon of plain RO got it down to 197 and it's pretty steady there.

I noticed the further out the ppm was on the high side, the quicker and more abrupt the pH changes were. Once I started getting close to where she wanted to be, things mellowed out a lot and now just doing fine adjustments to get in that sweet spot.

This is very interesting indeed. There is a 3 way going on here between ppm, pH and the plant itself. Once I studied that EC/PH Imbalance chart and started applying it, I started to see how they all interact with each other and my job is to find that sweet spot and then adapt as the needs of the plants change both in the early stages and in the late. I've noticed ppm changes as small as 30 will get you in and out of that sweet spot and so I make gradual moves in the direction I want to go based on the chart ad what the water is telling me.
So many different ways to grow and feed this plant. Love it
 
Only been at 206 since last night and so far, no, the ppm is remaining static, she is drinking albeit slowly because she is so small. So far today, ppms remained constant but pH started to drop a bit again so diluted with one more gallon of plain RO got it down to 197 and it's pretty steady there.
That small adjustment down with the ppm was all this res needed to stabilize with the pH. Got up this morning and everything is rock solid where I left it when I went to bed last night. As she starts to need more nutirents, she's gonna tell me through the water long before I see anything going on in the leaves is my theory.

Hell yea.
 
That small adjustment down with the ppm was all this res needed to stabilize with the pH. Got up this morning and everything is rock solid where I left it when I went to bed last night. As she starts to need more nutirents, she's gonna tell me through the water long before I see anything going on in the leaves is my theory.

Hell yea.
What will be your cue? Rise in pH and/or a drop in ppms?
 
What will be your cue? Rise in pH and/or a drop in ppms?
Any change in ppm or pH is my cue. I want the plant drinking water, ppm and pH to remain static, that is the perfect scenario.

If you have the EC/PPM Imbalance chart, print it out and pin it to the wall and study it. The right hand side is your rising EC, the left hand side is the dropping EC. Center/Center or Center/Right is where you want to be.

First, look at the EC(PPM) in the water. What is it doing? If it's rising, look to the right side of the chart. Then look at your water PH. What is it doing? Rising, falling, static? Then look at the appropriate part of the chart and that will tell you what to do. When it says change the res, I do not do that if I just changed it and am getting it stable. Ideally, I want one res change at flip and no more unless there are problems and I need a reset. So if it says change res and lower EC, I just lower the EC, write it down, and then observe....repeat as necessary to get the pH stable.
And when you're diluting the lower res, are you also diluting the top-off?

Once I have a stable res and I know what EC the plant wants, I mimmick the res for top offs, both for pH and ppm, at the proper ratios of course, and dump that in. For example, if my res is sitting at 5.9 and 335 ppm, I mix the top off in the proper ratios to get as close to 5.9 and 335 as possible, then add that to the res. The exception to that is if I have a diving pH and it gets to around 5.5, I do not pH my 7.0 water but just add the nutrients. That bump in pH helps bring that back in line in the res most of the time and once in a while I have to use a bit of PH UP or Agsil to get where I want to be. I try to use as little pH adjusters as possible, especially in flower.
 
The Mello Fellow Grow is chugging along, thinking this is a heavy Indica stain, short and squat.

Gave her a haircut today and some LST. This plant was topped at the 5th node and was super bushy. Got that all cleaned out and a bunch of fans out of the way, and then tied her down spread eagle.

Seems very slow in veg so far but everything is looking good so far.

Before-

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After-

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I've been wanting to flip this gal but still waiting to pull that trigger, just seems super slow. I looked back and I am about 9 weeks since sprout of seed, been a bit frustrating but not sure it's anything I am doing and probably just genetics. At any rate, she looks healthy, the res has been super stable and chugging along at 255 ppm. I might change out this res for bloom nutrients before I leave for work this week, and then flip when I get home on Monday. I want to fill the tent and so if I need to go another week or so longer than Monday, I will do that. Not worried about stretch on this plant at all.IMG_3582.jpegIMG_3583.jpegIMG_3584.jpegIMG_3585.jpeg
 
Edit; 255 ppms, impressive

I absolutely love this new way of growing that Anthem exposed me to. Basically, it's letting the water tell you what needs to be done, and it works.

I was thinking about this the other day and they way you and Moe do your main res with a top off res. I like the automation of this, but after learning this new way of growing in water, I would never want to go to a continuous top off for this very reason. After using this for a while on several different grows, it's very apparent to me that the water is telling you valuable information that will help you stay ahead of any issues with the plant before they arise. It's a daily stream of valuable information for me as a grower and helps me to see the bigger picture rather than what is right in front of me on the meter, if that makes sense.

Once you introduce automatic top offs, you no longer have this gauge to look at for information about what is going on in the root zone. It also turns things into a guessing game when you do give nutrient amendments, if you don't hit it right, you'll be chasing pH issues, and/or adding more pH adjusters than necessary getting the pH to stabilize if you land out of EC/pH balance with your amendments.

Not saying ya'all are doing it wrong at all. What you do obviously works very well for you. I have found this way of growing works best for me, at least at this time.
 
that makes sense.
It actually makes perfect sense and I've noticed things going smoother for you since picking up with Anthem. You are in better tune with what's going on with your grows than i am, i will say that.
Not saying ya'all are doing it wrong at all. What you do obviously works very well for you. I have found this way of growing works best for me, at least at this time.
Do you think your "system " would work running neither?
 
I absolutely love this new way of growing that Anthem exposed me to. Basically, it's letting the water tell you what needs to be done, and it works.

I was thinking about this the other day and they way you and Moe do your main res with a top off res. I like the automation of this, but after learning this new way of growing in water, I would never want to go to a continuous top off for this very reason. After using this for a while on several different grows, it's very apparent to me that the water is telling you valuable information that will help you stay ahead of any issues with the plant before they arise. It's a daily stream of valuable information for me as a grower and helps me to see the bigger picture rather than what is right in front of me on the meter, if that makes sense.

Once you introduce automatic top offs, you no longer have this gauge to look at for information about what is going on in the root zone. It also turns things into a guessing game when you do give nutrient amendments, if you don't hit it right, you'll be chasing pH issues, and/or adding more pH adjusters than necessary getting the pH to stabilize if you land out of EC/pH balance with your amendments.

Not saying ya'all are doing it wrong at all. What you do obviously works very well for you. I have found this way of growing works best for me, at least at this time.
Super happy you found your style and it works for you.

I'm not sure how I am destroying data by adding RO automatically? To me, if anything, it is giving me better resolution on the data available? Like smoke running 700 scale vs 500? Same data as yours, but mine is watered down?

I could grow the same way as you by turning off the valve on the float valve, and my water would drop with use. Then to maintain I would top off with RO and add nutes right? The only difference is that in mine the top off is continual, further dropping EC more quickly via dilution. RO water will not effect the PH info either way with auto top off or not. So we are just talking about EC. If you are chasing PH swings, it is not because my RO adds buffer to my grows or something.

I'm also measuring how much they drink daily on the water line in the RO res.

Am I looking at this wrong?
 
Super happy you found your style and it works for you.

I'm not sure how I am destroying data by adding RO automatically? To me, if anything, it is giving me better resolution on the data available? Like smoke running 700 scale vs 500? Same data as yours, but mine is watered down?

I could grow the same way as you by turning off the valve on the float valve, and my water would drop with use. Then to maintain I would top off with RO and add nutes right? The only difference is that in mine the top off is continual, further dropping EC more quickly via dilution. RO water will not effect the PH info either way with auto top off or not. So we are just talking about EC. If you are chasing PH swings, it is not because my RO adds buffer to my grows or something.

I'm also measuring how much they drink daily on the water line in the RO res.

Am I looking at this wrong?

Thanks bro, appreciate that. Gonna try to expand a bit here, see if I can show you exactly what I mean here. And please keep in mind, I am still trying to understand all this and why it works the way I have seen. I don't have those answers, just been trying this out to see if there is anything to it, and I believe there is.

What I am seeing is there is a complex relationship between the plant, and the water EC and pH. Pretty sure you are familiar with the chart I am using-

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The first thing I had to figure out is how to read the chart. Of note, look at EC first, then pH. Also, right side on the chart is for a res with a rising EC, left side is for a dropping EC, so I look at the EC FIRST multiple times each day and record that, usually mornings and evenings but more often if I am trying to get an unstable res stabilized. What is it doing? I had thought it's best to look over a course of at least 3 days to determine a trend, but have realized you can see this same trend almost immediately after making any changes to the water, like later in the day you can measure and see the trend. Then follow the chart on what to do depending on first, what the EC is trending, and secondly, where the pH is trending. Middle-middle/right on the chart is where ya want to be.

This, I believe, is where the plant comes into the equation. It's getting the water + nutrients and immediately does what it's gonna do and start eating/drinking. Based on what it needs, something is happening in there to make the pH move or stay stable. If the nutrient needs are right in line with what the plant wants, the pH changes very little, and I have found that window several times now and it's not a big window either. The opposite is true when there is too much or too little nutrients in the mix. I have found ppm changes as little as 30 will either make or break pH stability.

If you run a top off res, none of this information is available to you because no matter what is going on in your root zone, if the plants are drinking, your EC will fall from dilution alone but could also be falling from having too little nutrients in your res. You do not know which one is the real culprit with an auto top off. In my mind, it's a guessing game at that point. What? You threw out your GH feeding chart? Good on you, threw mine out too. Starting point for my res? I know a lot of guys like to start at 200=300 for new seedlings or clones. Is that a good place to start? Perhaps. That is what I am doing but quickly realize that 300 number is way too hot. How did I learn that? Not from the plants themselves. I learned it from the water and what that is telling me. Haven't nute burned one yet.

You have not destroyed any data in a sense, but rather, have made a situation where that data is impossible to collect. That is kinda why I called it a gauge like something on your truck dashboard. Gauges tell us things. Sometimes we have cars with no gauges. Do we need to know our oil pressure all the time? Probably not, but it's nice to have that there instead of a dummy light.

My RO water does affect my pH in that it will usually bring the pH up. My RO water is about 6.8-7 pH and will always bring the pH up a bit, more or less depending on which system we're talking about. 2 gallons of RO will raise the pH way more in the smaller systems than in that 4 site where there is almost 30 gallons in there.

So when I do my top offs I also use this info because I want to mimic my res in my top off as closely as possible, so that is what I do, in the proper ratios of course. I don't have to guess how much to add for ppms, I just make it the same as what is working already. The only guessing is geting to know the nutrients and how much to add of each to get to your target ppm, which I have found is fairly easy to do. Top offs do not need to be perfect, just close.
 
lol bro. Did not mean to rain on your parade! I always thought coco needed to be monitored at least as much as hydro, i dunno 🤷‍♂️

SLG, how big is your res?

All of my res's are just one more 8 gallon bucket, 5 buckets for the 4 site system and 2 for the singles, almost 30 gallons of water in the 4 site system and about 12-13 in the single site systems.
 
Flip Day on this gal!

I figure long enough on this one, changed out the res for bloom ratios, sitting a tad higher than she was in veg @ 363 ppm, going to watch and see what she wants. Set the light timer to 12/12 and cranked the intensity up to 60%. Roots look great.

A stout one she is and probably won’t need any support.

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Very happy plant man, great job.

The stalk reminds me of your mac dragon run. That was a good producer. You've done your part now let's see what she has hidden in there. 🧬
 
lol bro. Did not mean to rain on your parade! I always thought coco needed to be monitored at least as much as hydro, i dunno 🤷‍♂️



All of my res's are just one more 8 gallon bucket, 5 buckets for the 4 site system and 2 for the singles, almost 30 gallons of water in the 4 site system and about 12-13 in the single site systems.
I don’t monitor mine at all.it’s like chasing a ghost if you start checking ph of runoff when the plants aren’t showing any deficiency’s.what I do monitor is the enviroment as I set my temps and rh and air exchange manually..you get your enviroment in the ballpark and have a great light you shouldn’t get any problems once you have worked out your nutrients after a little time.mixing my nutes is where I spend most of my time and feeding them .emptying there trays etc…
 
Very happy plant man, great job.

The stalk reminds me of your mac dragon run. That was a good producer. You've done your part now let's see what she has hidden in there. 🧬
Thanks man, appreciate the compliment! I'm gettin there (y)

I thought the same thing about the Mac Dragon being very similar. I'm super pumped about this strain, both parents are elite and thinking there is great potential in those genes. I wanted to get some Cement Shoes, this was the closest I could get without a lot of effort, Marshmallow OG mom bred with Cement Shoes daddy.

We're about to find out...
 
Almost 10 days since flip, she is showing a bit of a stretch but not a lot as expected. Strong Indica genealogy is my guess. I’ve had to defoliate occasionally but almost done pruning, will do a bigger trim up middle of next week.

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Almost 10 days since flip, she is showing a bit of a stretch but not a lot as expected. Strong Indica genealogy is my guess. I’ve had to defoliate occasionally but almost done pruning, will do a bigger trim up middle of next week.

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pic of the month prize winner is....wow what a beauty buds are nice but that;s just pretty
 
Where did you get the genetics? Does Todd sell seeds?
No, Todd does not sell seeds.

I got this pack from a friend over at the other place, I'm pretty sure they were a prize in the potm and my buddy asked me if I wanted them, never gonna turn that down. CannaGranny got me interested in a strain called Cement Shoes. Could not find that strain but remembered Cement Shoes was a parent strain of something I had in my collection, turned out to be the Mellow Fellow so decided to run it. Seems I had remembered hearing good things about Cult Classic too.

Marshmallow OG is the other parent and is an elite from Compound Genetics that I have heard great things about.

I still have some if you are interested let me know.
 
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