Gassy Cream Cake Hydro scrog

[moe.red]

Shit man that is dialed in on paper.

I hate to say this I mean really…. How’s that mite situation going?



My only mite infection ^^^

 

[moe.red]

Look where the petioles meet the stalk with magnification

 

[Stoneyluv]

Shit man that is dialed in on paper.

I hate to say this I mean really…. How’s that mite situation going?

View attachment 90622

My only mite infection ^^^

Look where the petioles meet the stalk with magnification

i looked pretty good and i don't see a sign of a single insect of any kind. i need a make a bucket or something that holds the plant with the roots in water while i inspect. i'l look thorough tonight but i really don't see any signs at all. i'll probably cut a burned leaf off so i can lay it lat and look at it but just from bending and looking i saw nothing. nothing crawling or moving on the stems at all. no leaf chew marks either.

this seemed to happen just after i added the mr humic but it very well could just be a coincidence. i have enough top off solution mixed up without the mr humic that i could swap out the rez... i don't what else to do.

and then to add insult to injury i forgot to turn my humidifier back on after filling last night and it was back down to 40% today! dammit!!!

i know this sounds silly but could the dna be sensitive? i was looking at the same cultivar i have in soil and also has slight signs at the leaf edge, but not tacoing as much.

 

[steamroller]

Really looks like a nutrient issue to me. Which is why I stayed quiet.
N or K or both?
It certainly could be a fickle strain also IMO.

 

[Stoneyluv]

N or K or both?

like not enough of it right?

i've been running the exact same solution since birth, the only add was the mr humic. 300ppm at week four seems low but they're not getting better left alone.

and with everything frozen right now i don't really have enough rain water so if i need to do a change out it will have to be with my well water.

 

[steamroller]

Not enough IMO.
For what it is worth I have been installing the Mr. Humic almost every or every other feeding pretty liberally this grow of mine.
I know only a little is needed but I just pour a little....
I don't think the Mr.H is causing the issue.

 

[moe.red]

I e never seen a deficiency or imbalance present like this but always learning




Those are not taco even. The tips are folding over. Very weird.

 

[steamroller]

I e never seen a deficiency or imbalance present like this but always learning

View attachment 90673
View attachment 90674

Those are not taco even. The tips are folding over. Very weird.

That is not what my guess is on.
I am guessing by leaf dis coloration.
The curl could be lighting?

 

[moe.red]

Yeah there is more than one symptom here and we are looking at different parts on different plants.

Roots look fine.

Numbers look good.

I do not believe humic will do this but fulvic is better between the 2

Is there a lot of wind?

 

[moe.red]

like not enough of it right?

i've been running the exact same solution since birth, the only add was the mr humic. 300ppm at week four seems low but they're not getting better left alone.

and with everything frozen right now i don't really have enough rain water so if i need to do a change out it will have to be with my well water.

Let’s not change water yet. How is the ph trend? Stable or are you adjusting?

 

[moe.red]

Hmmmmm



Hope those white dots aren’t moving.

 

[moe.red]

Dude if you have any micronized sulfur put some on one plant at least at lights out. Done correctly it won’t hurt the plant at all but the bugs if there are any will fuck right off.

 

[Observer]

74f is lower temp side for me, slowing metabolism and nutrient uptake.

i think that K buffer is causing an issue as well.

the slight "taco" is from low rh

 

[Observer]

130ppm of floragrow with an added 70ppm of K?

did any area of the rootzone dry up?

 

[Stoneyluv]

Not enough IMO.
For what it is worth I have been installing the Mr. Humic almost every or every other feeding pretty liberally this grow of mine.
I know only a little is needed but I just pour a little....
I don't think the Mr.H is causing the issue.

i don't think it's the mr fulvic either.

they're light green and pale for sure. could the burn just be the leaves eating themselves? if all the minerals and nutes and balanced properly i would think they might not ever show a deficiency and just start taking from lower leaves. stoner thinking anyway..

That is not what my guess is on.
I am guessing by leaf dis coloration.
The curl could be lighting?

could be a combo, too much lighting and not enough food. GHG chart says this much for week one seedlings.

Yeah there is more than one symptom here and we are looking at different parts on different plants.

Roots look fine.

Numbers look good.

I do not believe humic will do this but fulvic is better between the 2

Is there a lot of wind?

the mr humic and mr fulvic are the same product. just labeled different for location...

and not much wind, just a little jiggle..

https://imgur.com/a/lkpHZ7Y

Let’s not change water yet. How is the ph trend? Stable or are you adjusting?

Moe this has been my most stable batch ever. in the three weeks plus it has crept from 5.5 to 6.0 i added 0.5ml of 20% down and accidentally overshot and had to put a ml of up in. this was a couple weeks ago before i connected to good humidifier. leaves have burned and continued to look bad since then so i figured my oops was recovered. i fixed it in the rez before it got to the plant sites so i assumed i was okay.

i assume a lot!!!!

i'm getting to the point where i could use a top off, i'm about a gallon low right now, it could be a good time to add some extra food if it is needed.

Hmmmmm

View attachment 90675

Hope those white dots aren’t moving.

me too man!!!!! we just got home so i'm gonna give them a very close inspection here in a bit... if i see anything at all i'll post it!!!

Dude if you have any micronized sulfur put some on one plant at least at lights out. Done correctly it won’t hurt the plant at all but the bugs if there are any will fuck right off.

i do... i think it's the right stuff, not sure if it's micronized but its a powder that i use on my soil plants in flowering for terps....



just sprinkle it right on the leaves? then wash it off before lights on?

74f is too low, slowing metabolism and nutrient uptake.

i think that K buffer is causing an issue as well.

the slight "taco" is from low rh

the rh sunk low up until a week ago, it was unstable and at most only 45% and at it's lowest was in the teens. it's ben a week now since it's been low, except for my fuck up last night.

i think i'm gonna raise the light up a bit more.

130ppm of floragrow with an added 70ppm of K?

did any area of the rootzone dry up?

no, not once been moist since day one. little droplets all around the inside.

 

[Observer]

i don't think it's the mr fulvic either.

they're light green and pale for sure. could the burn just be the leaves eating themselves? if all the minerals and nutes and balanced properly i would think they might not ever show a deficiency and just start taking from lower leaves. stoner thinking anyway..



could be a combo, too much lighting and not enough food. GHG chart says this much for week one seedlings.

View attachment 90684
View attachment 90685
View attachment 90686



the mr humic and mr fulvic are the same product. just labeled different for location...

and not much wind, just a little jiggle..

https://imgur.com/a/lkpHZ7Y

Moe this has been my most stable batch ever. in the three weeks plus it has crept from 5.5 to 6.0 i added 0.5ml of 20% down and accidentally overshot and had to put a ml of up in. this was a couple weeks ago before i connected to good humidifier. leaves have burned and continued to look bad since then so i figured my oops was recovered. i fixed it in the rez before it got to the plant sites so i assumed i was okay.

i assume a lot!!!!

i'm getting to the point where i could use a top off, i'm about a gallon low right now, it could be a good time to add some extra food if it is needed.



me too man!!!!! we just got home so i'm gonna give them a very close inspection here in a bit... if i see anything at all i'll post it!!!



i do... i think it's the right stuff, not sure if it's micronized but its a powder that i use on my soil plants in flowering for terps....

View attachment 90687

just sprinkle it right on the leaves? then wash it off before lights on?



the rh sunk low up until a week ago, it was unstable and at most only 45% and at it's lowest was in the teens. it's ben a week now since it's been low, except for my fuck up last night.

i think i'm gonna raise the light up a bit more.



no, not once been moist since day one. little droplets all around the inside.

raising the light wont hurt, see how it continues to develop.

 

[Observer]

any way to measure the ppfd?

 

[Stoneyluv]

any way to measure the ppfd?

yeah i have a modified ukrain surplus PAR meter!!!! .. funny but also true!!!

comin in a little hot!!! hahaha not terrible though.


raise the roof!!!!!!!

https://imgur.com/a/2GdYNX1

thats a little better... i'll monitor from here.

 

[Stoneyluv]

74f is lower temp side for me, slowing metabolism and nutrient uptake.

you're right about this, actually it's setpoint is 74 so it really runs at 75°, still low i understand... i was trying to balance out a perfect temp for an affordable electricity bill.

i just bumped both cabinets up 3° they should run around 78° air temp now.

 

[Stoneyluv]

Hmmmmm

View attachment 90675

Hope those white dots aren’t moving.

turns out it was just debris.. i think maybe sawdust from cutting the hole in the wall for the humidifier hose.



either way i did a very thorough inspection and i am proud to say i have zero bugs!!

i'm leaving another close up of each of the roots just in case something looks odd there.... they each have a brown spot in the middle, probably my nutes stain, it's not slimy and washes off but i wanted to post just in case..





i raised the temp a few degrees and also raised the light a few inches. i gave the smaller plant on the right some foliar spray to see if it makes a change..

 

[moe.red]

Ok Stoney this is a strange one.

Coupla points - fulvic and humic are not the same thing but very related. Humic has larger molecule size so not as easy to transport within the plant. That said the Mr series products contain the same stuff. Not generally true for other brands.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with 75* at this point. 78 is fine too. Lower temp will cause it to grow more slowly just like backing the light off does but would not induce imbalances.

Glad you got no bugs. It does have me scratching my head tho. To me those leaves I posted are not taco.



Those are taco. ^^^ (not Stoney’s plant)

This is your plant



From this angle it looks like one blade has its edges folded over not the whole blade being cupped ,and the blade next to it is flat. That screams to me something is acting on individual fan blades which typically would mean a pest.

Ph being largely steady with slight increase is good.

When I get to a big screen in a few hours I’ll take a much closer look. This one is a puzzle

Edit call me this afternoon if ya want. This top off should be strategic

@Aqua Man any ideas?

 

[Stoneyluv]

Coupla points - fulvic and humic are not the same thing but very related. Humic has larger molecule size so not as easy to transport within the plant. That said the Mr series products contain the same stuff. Not generally true for other brands.

i understand Moe, and i agree with ya. i didn't buy the mr humic on purpose, i thought it was mr fulvic till i opened the box and realized i ordered the wrong one, then was cool with it once i realized it was the same solution as what i wanted. i'm not positive but i think it has fulvic, humic, and a some aminos as well.

the only reason i went with it is because i stopped using the floralicious because it was messing with my ph and causing it to sink all the time. i took that out of the equation and the ph was so much easier to manage and i only needed half the amount of agsil16 and buffer K. and also OLDCRO was saying how the new recipe of floralicious didn't contain fulvic acid anymore and then a few minutes later i'm reading on Nesta's page how he really liked the mr fulvic and that made me remember Grump and other discussing it as well so i figured why not.

long story but thats the history of it all..

There is absolutely nothing wrong with 75* at this point. 78 is fine too. Lower temp will cause it to grow more slowly just like backing the light off does but would not induce imbalances.

i kinda figured and also when i was struggling to keep the rh up i thought the lower temp would be better for them anyway. i really thought this was all caused by low rh. but it's been more than a week since it's been over 60% and two sets of leaves are since then and even the new leaves are showing signs.

rom this angle it looks like one blade has its edges folded over not the whole blade being cupped ,and the blade next to it is flat. That screams to me something is acting on individual fan blades which typically would mean a pest.

you're right Moe, the serrated tips are curling up and bending in flat. the center vein is not creasing and the sides and not pulling closed like a taco leaf.

it starts with the serrations at the back wide part of the leaves then works its way towards the tip.

Ph being largely steady with slight increase is good.

i'm glad we didn't jump to a rez change because this honestly has been the best i've ever gotten it to date.

When I get to a big screen in a few hours I’ll take a much closer look. This one is a puzzle

thanks for your time man!!!! one other detail, this didn't start happening till the beginning of week three. then took three or four days until the tips died.

when i was inspecting them the underside of the plants seemed "fuzzier" than normal. almost reminded me of mullein leaves. not bad fuzzy but just softer and different texture than my soil plants at the same age.

 

[Observer]

Ok Stoney this is a strange one.

Coupla points - fulvic and humic are not the same thing but very related. Humic has larger molecule size so not as easy to transport within the plant. That said the Mr series products contain the same stuff. Not generally true for other brands.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with 75* at this point. 78 is fine too. Lower temp will cause it to grow more slowly just like backing the light off does but would not induce imbalances.

Glad you got no bugs. It does have me scratching my head tho. To me those leaves I posted are not taco.

View attachment 90717

Those are taco. ^^^ (not Stoney’s plant)

This is your plant

View attachment 90718

From this angle it looks like one blade has its edges folded over not the whole blade being cupped ,and the blade next to it is flat. That screams to me something is acting on individual fan blades which typically would mean a pest.

Ph being largely steady with slight increase is good.

When I get to a big screen in a few hours I’ll take a much closer look. This one is a puzzle

Edit call me this afternoon if ya want. This top off should be strategic

@Aqua Man any ideas?

i just dont see how that isnt the start of tacoing from either low rh and high PPFD

something burned them

ur rh was fine once you got back to 60 but you were running 500 ppfd over those little ones?

the very top new growth looks great though.

 

[Observer]

could it be DO deficient?

 

[Observer]

i just wanna figure it out, i hate not being able to.

 

[Observer]

other thing is if it dried up at all somewhere, or if the root connection was hampered at some point.

 

[moe.red]

Hey stoney is this stalk OK or is that a little rot I see?



Coco looks very wet. Cotyledons look super. If that mix was short on N they would be brown.

 

[Observer]

Hey stoney is this stalk OK or is that a little rot I see?



Coco looks very wet. Cotyledons look super. If that mix was short on N they would be brown.

nice eye on the stem, didnt see that but the next thing i saw was how soggy this is






View attachment 90770

 

[Stoneyluv]

i just dont see how that isnt the start of tacoing from either low rh and high PPFD

we'll see soon enough, raising the light is the only change i made esides the one foliar spray of the right plant.

something burned them

i wonder if they just destroyed their cells from curling so agressive?

ur rh was fine once you got back to 60 but you were running 500 ppfd over those little ones?

nah, not the whole time. i started out at 10% and added ten at the end of each week. i should be at 40% right now but in holding pattern due to this, i've grown more seedlings than i can count with this light and i'm being very easy and conservative on them right now.

i'm not convinced it's a light issue, but if it clears up in the next few days then i'll be wrong...

the very top new growth looks great though.

it's been like this too.. new growth looks good then next set starts curling.

other thing is if it dried up at all somewhere, or if the root connection was hampered at some point.

View attachment 90767

maybe a 1% chance but these had roots hit the water in a few days and didn't have a single hicup with the system or power outage or anything. i have graphs that are rock steady.

Hey stoney is this stalk OK or is that a little rot I see?

View attachment 90769

Coco looks very wet. Cotyledons look super. If that mix was short on N they would be brown.

with a deep sigh of relief, NO.. not sure what that discoloration is though.. i dug all around it and tried to get a better pic...



.
.

these leaves were nice and flat last night... this is the very start of the curl...





edit>> you can see how even the newest growth is showing the earliest sign.. six o'clock on that photo shows it^

nice eye on the stem, didnt see that but the next thing i saw was how soggy this is


View attachment 90771



View attachment 90770

it may look that way but i just checked to confirm... damp but not wet, this is where i wanna be right?

 

[Observer]

little antagonist somewhere