Grump's Gassy Cream Cake Grow 🌱

[CannaGranny]

Hey Grump, I found out today that Redbeards recommended using damp paper towels and a ziplock as opposed to soaking them! I soak, so that’s what was in my head. Sorry about the misinformation. The wet towel method is super close to the VG. Just wanted to clear that up.
You got an update?

 

[CannaGranny]

I wonder what the lines on my palms say about me?

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@GrumpAzz
Do you have one of the first VG designs we came up with?
Crossing over was an issue with early models and I've since tweeked the design to have way deeper channels to keep taps in the lane.
Main thing is only two layers of paper on the corrugated part to keep them sitting deep in the channel then 2-4 layers to cover them.
If you like, I can send you and updated version. I think we're on around the 6th generation of the VG always trying to improve it.
This simplified model with deep channels is probably my favorite so far. Works great and eliminates my fumbling issue I was having with the two sided design

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@Observer
Same offer to you Brother. Just pick a color

I’m pretty sure you palm reads, Feck Around and Find Out???

 

[Zen_seeker]

Haahahaha..I did similar not once but twice.lmao..i have problems just turning one off one tap lol..I started filling up my spare bucket for nutes from the 5000 litre tank outside…went inside and pigged out and never came back out till nxt morning .

Twice I’ve left the sink water running to fill a 2 gallon jug.

I walk away to do something else and…squirrel

 

[Zen_seeker]

Hey Grump, I found out today that Redbeards recommended using damp paper towels and a ziplock as opposed to soaking them! I soak, so that’s what was in my head. Sorry about the misinformation. The wet towel method is super close to the VG. Just wanted to clear that up.
You got an update?

Funny. This is the way I was taught by family, middle school, and reading over the years. Paper towel was the grey/brown type but the rest remains the same.

VG has been 100% so far. Planning to use one for all the garden veggies next year. Start them in the tent.

 

[GrumpAzz]

Do you have one of the first VG designs we came up with?
Crossing over was an issue with early models and I've since tweeked the design to have way deeper channels to keep taps in the lane.
Main thing is only two layers of paper on the corrugated part to keep them sitting deep in the channel then 2-4 layers to cover them.
If you like, I can send you and updated version. I think we're on around the 6th generation of the VG always trying to improve it.
This simplified model with deep channels is probably my favorite so far. Works great and eliminates my fumbling issue I was having with the two sided design

I have one of the first generation VGs. Whichever gen Moe printed the BB logos on.

Like I said though, no issues with germination. All the taproots headed down, but transferring to the plugs was a pain. It worked, don't get me wrong, but the taproot never seemed to settle down. Maybe I transferred them too late? Like.. the little seedling with it's root included is longer than the plug is tall. When they germ in the plug, the root hits a good amount of resistance early, causing several sideshoots to leave the plug about the same time as the taproot. Those little sideshoots make a big difference in growth rate. From the VG, the taproot, for me anyway, just seems to have free reign and never seems to hit enough resistance to spur the heavy sideshoot growth.

That making sense? Like... the VG germs perfectly, but in my experience, didn't transfer well. I know SweetLeaf germs in the VG and transfers to plugs so I may not have done it quite right. I don't think I paid enough attention to his initial root growth, though.

Hey Grump, I found out today that Redbeards recommended using damp paper towels and a ziplock as opposed to soaking them! I soak, so that’s what was in my head. Sorry about the misinformation. The wet towel method is super close to the VG. Just wanted to clear that up.
You got an update?

Gotcha. I'm starting to think I've allowed my plugs to become oversaturated. Every one of RB's beans had a little tail, but most stopped there. I dissected all but 2 last night. I've got two that sprouted and survived. The little curly-cue bugger didn't make it.

So far, 6 out of the other 10 have sprouted in what I believe was 5 days. 4 of them look really good and the other two look a little too wet. 2 have their first set of leaves and I expect to see two more follow suit today. I'll likely just run with them and potentially start a new thread.

As I've narrowed down my issue, I've gotten hella antsy and wanna see some action. It's been more than a month since the tent has seen any life. I would throw another pack of RB's at it, since I think I've got my problems sorted, but I wanna grow NOW. I don't want to delay my grow another week. 4 of the new sprouts will likely go into the tent today or tomorrow so I can feel like I'm actually growing again.

 

[CannaGranny]

I tried those plugs for germination a couple of times. I found they are much better at least for me for cloning. I just always planted the whole plug. Does make for some beautiful roots!
You are right, being too saturated will literally drown your seed. I did that too! Not too many Feck up’s I haven’t done. Hell, we all have. That’s how I learned. If it costs me money, I learn fast!

 

[GoodShit97]

I wasn't a fan of starting seeds in those plugs either.
Maybe try Rockwool or @moe.red method and just do net cups of coco

 

[CannaGranny]

I use cups of soil. The day before I saturate them and let them drain for 24 hours. My planting depth is 1/4” with just enough soil to barely cover the seed. As soon as the top of the soil shows drying, I spray them, just enough to wet the soil. I stay pretty much at a rate of 100% germination. I literally can’t remember the last time any didn’t pop.
When I fill my bags to plant, I set a cup in the middle and fill around the outside of it. I cut the side of the cup with the new plant in it, pull the cup and the plant just fits in the hole, like a plug.

 

[GoodShit97]

I use cups of soil. The day before I saturate them and let them drain for 24 hours. My planting depth is 1/4” with just enough soil to barely cover the seed. As soon as the top of the soil shows drying, I spray them, just enough to wet the soil. I stay pretty much at a rate of 100% germination. I literally can’t remember the last time any didn’t pop.
When I fill my bags to plant, I set a cup in the middle and fill around the outside of it. I cut the side of the cup with the new plant in it, pull the cup and the plant just fits in the hole, like a plug.

We do it the same exact way! It really works well.

 

[CannaGranny]

We do it the same exact way! It really works well.

It really does! I do soak for 24 hours prior to planting. Everything popped right up this time, but I do have a runt of the bunch. It came up three days later than the rest.

 

[GrumpAzz]

I wasn't a fan of starting seeds in those plugs either.
Maybe try Rockwool or @moe.red method and just do net cups of coco

Man they're just too easy... until they're not

I haven't had any troubles until this go at it, but it's been rough enough to think about ditching them. My Dalato beans germed 7 for 7 in plugs that were nearly two years old, though...

 

[GoodShit97]

It really does! I do soak for 24 hours prior to planting. Everything popped right up this time, but I do have a runt of the bunch. It came up three days later than the rest.

I have some seeds soaking that are due to go in soil soon.
Forgot to fill my cups on time yesterday so I gotta wait another few hours for them to drain more.
Looks like all my seeds cracked, no tails yet tho but they cracked so that's something!

 

[GoodShit97]

Man they're just too easy... until they're not

I haven't had any troubles until this go at it, but it's been rough enough to think about ditching them. My Dalato beans germed 7 for 7 in plugs that were nearly two years old, though...

Yeah i hear you man, I'm going through the same crap with my clones so I know the pain lol

 

[MDK]

I used to do the paper towel method in a sandwich baggy, that always worked pretty good just can't forget about it too long or you can see some pink mold. Since back growing I had that stash of seed I had collected from bags my old sandwich bag method just seemed to fail.

Now I do the seed soak for 12-16 hours, then to the VG once they crack but I put the VG in a sandwich bag. When I open the bag I literally blow into the bag a few times for a CO2 boost and some warmth....the baggie seems to really help IMO

 

[Bandit420]

I have one of the first generation VGs. Whichever gen Moe printed the BB logos on.

Like I said though, no issues with germination. All the taproots headed down, but transferring to the plugs was a pain. It worked, don't get me wrong, but the taproot never seemed to settle down. Maybe I transferred them too late? Like.. the little seedling with it's root included is longer than the plug is tall. When they germ in the plug, the root hits a good amount of resistance early, causing several sideshoots to leave the plug about the same time as the taproot. Those little sideshoots make a big difference in growth rate. From the VG, the taproot, for me anyway, just seems to have free reign and never seems to hit enough resistance to spur the heavy sideshoot growth.

That making sense? Like... the VG germs perfectly, but in my experience, didn't transfer well. I know SweetLeaf germs in the VG and transfers to plugs so I may not have done it quite right. I don't think I paid enough attention to his initial root growth, though.

I would ditch the plugs and go direct into your netcup or use neoprene collars.
I like collars and aero.
Performance flashed so well here it's changed how I start now. Aero to soil from here on out. DWC could also be used as long as the water level is high enough or even modify it into bubbleponics which is DWC with a drip line up to the netcup for the first two week to ensure watering.
This is so ez and straight to the chase and there's no need for plugs

 

[Zen_seeker]

Man they're just too easy... until they're not

I haven't had any troubles until this go at it, but it's been rough enough to think about ditching them. My Dalato beans germed 7 for 7 in plugs that were nearly two years old, though...

Squeezing them out before adding the seeds mandatory. I’ve lost a few veggies rushing and not drying out the peat enough.

Clones I can do in soil, plugs or my red coffee can with water. But seeds I have best luck waiting for spring temperatures regardless of method. (VG hasn’t been tested between December-March yet.)

If all else fails I go back to paper towel in a ziplock baggie. Tucked into a warm dark drawer of clothes. That was always 85% or better success.

I understand your concern about transferring from the VG to either a cup of soil or a plug but if you make a hole with a long skinny object and can get it to slide in it should be fine. Just tap the cup on the counter after or squeeze the plug a bit to set the root.

Regardless you’ll get this. Just a slump that will pass.

 

[Zen_seeker]

I would ditch the plugs and go direct into your netcup or use neoprene collars.
I like collars and aero.
Performance flashed so well here it's changed how I start now. Aero to soil from here on out. DWC could also be used as long as the water level is high enough or even modify it into bubbleponics which is DWC with a drip line up to the netcup for the first two week to ensure watering.
This is so ez and straight to the chase and there's no need for plugs

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I need to find 4 neoprene plugs for my coffee can cloner. Foam insulation is okay but doesn’t put any side force to hold the clones in place.

My store that carried some closed it’s doors before I could see if they had any in my size. Must not be a typical separate purchase?

Keeping my eye open for a better alternative like that thick black packing foam. But some seems too dense.

 

[steamroller]

I need to find 4 neoprene plugs for my coffee can cloner. Foam insulation is okay but doesn’t put any side force to hold the clones in place.

My store that carried some closed it’s doors before I could see if they had any in my size. Must not be a typical separate purchase?

Keeping my eye open for a better alternative like that thick black packing foam. But some seems too dense. View attachment 81314

I got plugs for you if you want.
Even got a Folgers coffee can lid if you need to make different size holes.
What size plugs you need?
I bought them by the hundred I think in multiple colors.

 

[Zen_seeker]

I got plugs for you if you want.
Even got a Folgers coffee can lid if you need to make different size holes.
What size plugs you need?
I bought them by the hundred I think in multiple colors.

Cool. Thanks man. Not sure it’s worth the postage but I’ll measure and get back to you. Postal strike is still in force so no hurry.

It’s a standard hole saw size but I don’t recall at the moment. It allowed 4 clones to fit nicely.

 

[Bandit420]

I need to find 4 neoprene plugs for my coffee can cloner. Foam insulation is okay but doesn’t put any side force to hold the clones in place.

My store that carried some closed it’s doors before I could see if they had any in my size. Must not be a typical separate purchase?

Keeping my eye open for a better alternative like that thick black packing foam. But some seems too dense. View attachment 81314

I'm seeing some $15/40 options on Amazon Canada

Amazon.ca : neoprene cloning collars

Not too bad since in the USA I pay the same but get 70 collars.
But you're right about shipping. $15 worth of collars would probably cost $50 to ship it up to Canada from Texas, probably a little less from NY.
Neoprene is choice because it deters infections and repels moisture.
Maybe 10 years ago there were size differences between different brands but now everything is 2" diameter across all brands.
The multi color kit is great for separating strains by color coding them.

But yeah, cloning machines are not just for clones. Seedlings take off like crazy in them and is why I'll be starting sprouts and doing about 10 days in veg using my cloner then planting into soil from now on. VG to clone machine is the fastest and most robust performance I've ever seen starting a new grow.
Did a test run on this grow so now I'm making the wholesale switch because it was so dang fast and the young sprouts absolutely loved it compared to traditional ways of starting in soil from the start or using plugs/rockwool or anything else along those lines.
In hydro it's even easier. Start in a cloner for veg and flower in DWC

 

[GoodShit97]

I need to find 4 neoprene plugs for my coffee can cloner. Foam insulation is okay but doesn’t put any side force to hold the clones in place.

My store that carried some closed it’s doors before I could see if they had any in my size. Must not be a typical separate purchase?

Keeping my eye open for a better alternative like that thick black packing foam. But some seems too dense. View attachment 81314

Shit i was supposed to send you 20 with your seeds.
I have a bunch

 

[steamroller]

To add to what Bandit said about sprouts in the collars the collars are made to fit 2 inch net pots, which I would think hydro guys could fill will their media and then just place the whole 2 inch pot in a larger pot when needed.

 

[GrumpAzz]

Word. Something to look into. Thanks @Bandit420 and @steamroller. This is something to consider and look into for my next grows. I think these new clay pebbles would work great for that. They're 3-5mm and perfectly round. If they work out... I really like 'em.


-------

In other news, after a lot of cleaning and extra finishing touches... I took 4 Gelonade X BBC sprouts and threw them in the system with the tent set at 85 degrees and 70%. 6 of them sprouted but 2 rotted off. I want some green in the tent so in they went.

They're getting 150ppm of CaMg and Grow A/B. Water level set to the bottom of the netpots. Light is as high as I can mount it set to 4r:5w:10b. I'll keep a close eye on them and adjust it accordingly.

I might start a new thread for them at this point...

 

[Observer]

I wonder what the lines on my palms say about me?

View attachment 81061

@GrumpAzz
Do you have one of the first VG designs we came up with?
Crossing over was an issue with early models and I've since tweeked the design to have way deeper channels to keep taps in the lane.
Main thing is only two layers of paper on the corrugated part to keep them sitting deep in the channel then 2-4 layers to cover them.
If you like, I can send you and updated version. I think we're on around the 6th generation of the VG always trying to improve it.
This simplified model with deep channels is probably my favorite so far. Works great and eliminates my fumbling issue I was having with the two sided design

View attachment 81062

View attachment 81063

@Observer
Same offer to you Brother. Just pick a color

Gray, black, white, opaque, purple/pinkish.

Yall the best

 

[Observer]

Twice I’ve left the sink water running to fill a 2 gallon jug.

I walk away to do something else and…squirrel

Haha.....yea....

 

[SiamSam]

Hey Grump, I found out today that Redbeards recommended using damp paper towels and a ziplock as opposed to soaking them! I soak, so that’s what was in my head. Sorry about the misinformation. The wet towel method is super close to the VG. Just wanted to clear that up.
You got an update?

Soak for 12-24 hours in water first and then put in towel or just use the towel method only? Is this strain specific? Please elucidate.

 

[Observer]

Soak for 12-24 hours in water first and then put in towel or just use the towel method only? Is this strain specific? Please elucidate.

I usually soak

But I think it "drowns" them overall.

 

[CannaGranny]

Soak for 12-24 hours in water first and then put in towel or just use the towel method only? Is this strain specific? Please elucidate.

I soak for 24 hours in a fifty fifty mix of water and 3% peroxide, and then plant them in the soil. I do it to all of my seeds regardless of strain.

 

[moe.red]

I soak for 24 hours in a fifty fifty mix of water and 3% peroxide, and then plant them in the soil. I do it to all of my seeds regardless of strain.

I like to start the process with some peroxide or chlorine too. End up with only the microbes you want in the grow.

 

[steamroller]

Soak for 12-24 hours in water first and then put in towel or just use the towel method only? Is this strain specific? Please elucidate.

These are the directions / tips I received with my very recent Captain Redbeard seed purchase.
I got Oregon Grapes which Granny has grown 3 times.