Grump's Power Plant Grow.

[Aqua Man]

I agree with Aqua. Small changes. It will not hurt to back the light off to give you a bit more time to dial things in.

Adding Cal Mag is also a good idea for the reasons Aqua mentions.

N is a "luxury" molecule in that if it is present in the nute mix it WILL be taken up by the plant. That can be a problem later, but for right now N is in demand according to my eye.

A good point on the WILL be taken up. Also why Nitrate nitrogen is a better choice imo because ammonium nitrogen is far more concentrated and converts to nitrate nitrogen at a rate of about 1 to 4 and when taken up by the plants in ammonium form carries the same impact and can burn plants fast and harder to control. Plus ammonium nitrogen requires another process and will cause the plant to lower PH levels of the media through ion exchange. Where nitrate nitrogen does the opposite and gives us the trend of a rising ph.
Atleast for hydro we want as little ammonium nitrogen as possible. The same is not tue in soil even though it has the same effect

 

[GrumpAzz]

Adding Cal Mag is also a good idea for the reasons Aqua mentions.

I backed the light off 3% before I headed to my parents to drop the kiddo off. I'll add another 1ml/gal calmag when I get back home. That'll bring it into the 300-350 range ppm.

 

[Aqua Man]

1 tip @GrumpAzz i found that you don’t need to mess with intensity much. Find the soot that they are happy with then leave it as the plants grow in height the will naturally increase the level of intensity as they get taller.

 

[Anthem275]

Now not only do we need to watch the photosynthetic rates but also the photosaturation which is when the plant starts to become unable to clear the stores of energy produced and basically gets backed up and the plant will go into photorespiration.

I may have something incorrect in my previous statements. I mentioned it was the root system that cannot keep up but above you mentioned the plant is unable to clear the energy stores. Does that occur at the leaf?

 

[Anthem275]

This is where DLI comes in because at a certain point plants shift towards photorespiration because they cannot keep up with the photosynthetic rates demanded by the intensity of the light. So you can either shorten the photoperiod a bit or lower the light intensity. Many variables go into this… especially co2 as it increases photosynthetic efficiency and thus increases the photosynthetic rates a plant can perform reducing photorespiration. Basically allows the plant to not only make more energy but for longer periods.

It is funny you bring this up. I was just going over some stuff with a fellow grower and I mentioned I added Co2 to my veg and it changed my plants growth rates and structure. I use some bar style LED's for veg and I start the plants out on 3 and change to 4 and then go to 7 off these. I noticed the plants where handling light much better than without Co2 but I also noticed the plant structure has changed to a much more bushy growth rate.

 

[Aqua Man]

I may have something incorrect in my previous statements. I mentioned it was the root system that cannot keep up but above you mentioned the plant is unable to clear the energy stores. Does that occur at the leaf?

General in the leaf but the whole plant in general… since it’s basically a chain dependant on all processes working in balance

 

[Aqua Man]

It is funny you bring this up. I was just going over some stuff with a fellow grower and I mentioned I added Co2 to my veg and it changed my plants growth rates and structure. I use some bar style LED's for veg and I start the plants out on 3 and change to 4 and then go to 7 off these. I noticed the plants where handling light much better than without Co2 but I also noticed the plant structure has changed to a much more bushy growth rate.

Your observations 100% coincide with what you should see… the structure is likely more due to the spectral makeup of the light… if you go more red leaning they will stretch out.

Just adding this its not directed towards you or your observation but it is relevant.

Often growers confuse height with growth rates when it is mass they should be looking at. A blue leaning spectrum will lend itself more favourable to short bushy vegetative growth thats more leafy…. Beneficial to increase overall photosynthesis but can create its own problems. Whereas red leaning will lend itself more favourably towards root and shoot growth. A balance imo is the best option. Of course this comes in handy depending on your genetics to manipulate the structure you want

 

[GrumpAzz]

Added 1ml/gal CalMag to both the top-off and plant resevoirs which brings me up to 330-340ppm. Here's the lable @Aqua Man

 

[Aqua Man]

Added 1ml/gal CalMag to both the top-off and plant resevoirs which brings me up to 330-340ppm. Here's the lable @Aqua Man
View attachment 24589

Yup looks good. Im betting you should see them green up a bit more in about 2-5 days. If not a further slight adjustment may benefit you but always small adjustments with time to see the results is the way to go

 

[Anthem275]

Your observations 100% coincide with what you should see… the structure is likely more due to the spectral makeup of the light… if you go more red leaning they will stretch out.

Just adding this its not directed towards you or your observation but it is relevant.

Often growers confuse height with growth rates when it is mass they should be looking at. A blue leaning spectrum will lend itself more favourable to short bushy vegetative growth thats more leafy…. Beneficial to increase overall photosynthesis but can create its own problems. Whereas red leaning will lend itself more favourably towards root and shoot growth. A balance imo is the best option. Of course this comes in handy depending on your genetics to manipulate the structure you want

@Aqua Man I have to take the light out of the equation because it is the same light I have been using for years in the set up.

 

[Aqua Man]

@Aqua Man I have to take the light out of the equation because it is the same light I have been using for years in the set up.

The ability to utilize a higher intensity would be how i would try to explain that then.

 

[Observer]

Nice 411

Was thinking it could use a tad bit more nitro

 

[GrumpAzz]

What's going on here with my first set of leaves? Is this damping like @tobh was afraid of?

 

[Max]

Damping off happens at the base of stem..that looks like pm..you maybe need to increase your airflow..

 

[GrumpAzz]

Damping happens at the base of stem..that looks like pm..you maybe need to increase your airflow..

Does pm rub off? This doesn't rub off.

 

[Max]

Haha..we wished .needs to b treated or take the leaf off.but wait till what others say..I’ve never had it..

 

[GoodShit97]

What's going on here with my first set of leaves? Is this damping like @tobh was afraid of?View attachment 24888

Not sure what it is thats going on there, but its not mildew. I know that much.

 

[Observer]

Does pm rub off? This doesn't rub off.

Have you dropped any solution on it?

Referring to the lighter shade, yellow in the middle and the wilted edge?

 

[Observer]

I think you said you had the light at 17% Id go down a little to slow things down possibly till sorted out

 

[GrumpAzz]

Have you dropped any solution on it?

Referring to the lighter shade, yellow in the middle and the wilted edge?

No. It did have a bit of condensation gathered around the cotyledons when it was still just a sprout and in the dome. Nothing since being moved into the system

I think you said you had the light at 17% Id go down a little to slow things down possibly till sorted out

I dropped it down to 14% yestersay and added some CalMag. The yellowing definitely progressed some today. I'll get another pic of it in the morning and I'll check the underside. I'll also drop it down to 10% while we figure this out.

 

[Observer]

No. It did have a bit of condensation gathered around the cotyledons when it was still just a sprout and in the dome. Nothing since being moved into the system

I dropped it down to 14% yestersay and added some CalMag. The yellowing definitely progressed some today. I'll get another pic of it in the morning and I'll check the underside. I'll also drop it down to 10% while we figure this out.

What's the new growth looking like

 

[Chemistry]

Is your net pot sat in water? If so, lower your water to half an inch under your pot. Check for the onset of Root Rot. Any time I grow in water I use an enzyme.

 

[smoke]

All things added are equal parts. Calmag/green/purple/pink.

The lable on the GH bottles suggest 1:1:1 at this stage and I've added the calmag at the same dose. I think Smoke follows this chart here for the ratios albeit custom doses.
View attachment 24575

As you probably know, all ive ever grown is GH 3 part.

From day one all my veg room gets fed is the aggressive vegetative growt ratios of 3 parts 2part and 1part plus calmag at 3ml/gal

My guess now is it wants calcium and more feed.

Edit; plant that size won't be taking in much calcium

 

[Observer]

As you probably know, all ive ever grown is GH 3 part.

From day one all my veg room gets fed is the aggressive vegetative growt ratios of 3 parts 2part and 1part plus calmag at 3ml/gal

My guess now is it wants calcium and more feed.

Think he was around 260ppms we were saying 300

 

[smoke]

Think he was around 260ppms we were saying 300

Clones that are a week old in my room are at 320 ppm on the 700 scale.

My bet is to leave the ppm where it is and just change the ratios to 3 2 1

 

[Aqua Man]

Take off the cover over the top of your pots. Its creating a very high humidity zone around the stem.

Leaves closest cannot properly transpire and your risking crown rot or other infections

 

[GrumpAzz]

Is your net pot sat in water? If so, lower your water to half an inch under your pot. Check for the onset of Root Rot. Any time I grow in water I use an enzyme.

The wayer level is roughly an inch below the netpot. I've got 2ml/gal of Orca in the res.

As you probably know, all ive ever grown is GH 3 part.

From day one all my veg room gets fed is the aggressive vegetative growt ratios of 3 parts 2part and 1part plus calmag at 3ml/gal

My guess now is it wants calcium and more feed.

Edit; plant that size won't be taking in much calcium

Ratios right now are 2:1:1:1 (calmag, brown, green, pink)

Think he was around 260ppms we were saying 300

After yesterday's added CalMag we're up to 330 on the 500 scale.

Take the cover over the top of your pots. Its creating a very high humidity zone around the stem.

Leaves closest cannot properly transpire and your risking crown rot or other infections

Dang really? Last round I was told to cover the pot to keep my roots from air pruning because hydroton doesn't do a very good job blocking light penetration.

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Thanks for the tips folks. I'll snap a couple more pics when the lady gets up. I'm on early morning Dad duty right now. Cuddles and South Park.

 

[CannaGranny]

I have an obsessive urge to Schwazze my plant.

Don’t do it! I did that..once. Once was all it took to! Looked like naked chickens sitting atop of my scrog, and greatly diminished my take.

 

[CannaGranny]

Yeah and cutting the plant down was a PIA. I didn't smash it with the first screen like Granny does. I just wove everything and kept tucking. Everything was knotted up and grown together by the end.

That’s why I tell you guys to never weave your scrog, push em down and let them go. Doing a through lollypopping at the time you table will get rid of all the larf too. Anything that does not reach the tabletop goes. Hard to make yourself do this, but even harder to look at a bunch of larf that could have been bulk to my upper main colas.

 

[Aqua Man]

Don’t do it! I did that..once. Once was all it took to! Looked like naked chickens sitting atop of my scrog, and greatly diminished my take.

Yeah there is a real art to doing this correctly. Timing, nutrient changes, environmental changes etc. or else you create problems. Its definitely an advanced technique that needs very closely monitored and understood before attempting